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Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Printable Version

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Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Dusk - 2008-12-30

Takebacker Wrote:Have you been maxing it after burst fire? o_o

No, of course not. My build at this point is

Max Burst Fire
13 Ice (2 seconds, 4 targets, replaces Blank Shot 95% of the time)
10 Octopus

Going to finish Octo, get Ice to 26, and add 15 to Gaviota before proceeding to max Flamethrower and Homing.

I'm going with Flamethrower because the mobbing situation for Outlaws is REALLY bad.

Other mob skills in 4th job (discounting the undeniably useless Grenade and the obsolete Invis)
Air Strike - very powerful, but has a 5 second cooldown, and seems more useful for causing a lot of collateral area damage than blasting away at a specific target
Battleship Torpedo - most builds don't have this at 20+ until at least 14x, if not well into 15x and 16x. Also requires Battleship mode (limits mobility slightly, may break occasionally?)
Ice Splitter - Not very useful for damage, except on ice weaks, or in tandem with FT.

Granted, with the maps we have right now, ranged classes don't need to do much mobbing after level 100, but I generally prefer the option of versatility. Even if a skill won't help me train or boss, if I ever find myself in a situation while hunting for a drop or doing a quest where it comes in handy, I want it. Gaviota looks helpful at Newties for 3rd job, and that's why I'm investing in it before FT, but it seems the general opinion among Corsairs is that it becomes useless early in 4th. Meanwhile, FT fills a gap in our mobbing ability that doesn't get filled until at least mid 4th job, if ever.

Oh, and with a full 5 second burn, (FT-Ice-Burst Firex5) FT does 200% damage.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Russt - 2008-12-30

Dusk Wrote:Oh, and with a full 5 second burn, (FT-Ice-Burst Firex5) FT does 200% damage.
Not if Ice cancels it. Does it?

Interestingly enough, with maxed Elemental Amp and a 7 second burn (assuming Amp does lengthen its burn and not just Ice's freeze) that becomes 612%.

Now I wonder if you can stack burns...

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Dusk - 2008-12-30

Russt Wrote:Not if Ice cancels it. Does it?

Interestingly enough, with maxed Elemental Amp and a 7 second burn (assuming Amp does lengthen its burn and not just Ice's freeze) that becomes 612%.

Now I wonder if you can stack burns...

Ice doesn't cancel the burn. The monsters keep burning while frozen, which is really nice. The only thing that can cancel the burn is renewing the burn with another Flamethrower. So no, you can't stack burns.

How did you get 612%, btw? I'm getting 320*1.35 = 432%.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Russt - 2008-12-30

Amp's "Bullet Damage +5%" increases the burn effect damage.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Dusk - 2008-12-30

Russt Wrote:Amp's "Bullet Damage +5%" increases the burn effect damage.
Oh, snap, it burns for 32% damage for 5, possibly 7 seconds? Brbmakingcorsair

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Russt - 2008-12-30

And we believe the 200% to be additive, because it's 6% at level 1, and if it was multiplicative, that'd be implying that Flamethrower deals 9.6% damage.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Dusk - 2008-12-30

Russt Wrote:And we believe the 200% to be additive, because it's 6% at level 1, and if it was multiplicative, that'd be implying that Flamethrower deals 9.6% damage.

This is getting repetitive, but wow. You just changed my attitude towards Flamethrower from "yes please, I'd like to be able to mob" to "holy pomegranate I want FT and Amp now." This just moved Amp up in my priority of skills to get in 4th job. Something like after Cannon and Bullseye, but before significantly investing in Rapid Fire, Air Strike, and Torpedo now.

Now I just need to hear that it's actually +200% = 300% of 160%. 480% *1.70 FT = 816% o_o

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Russt - 2008-12-30

lol
Burns can't be stacked though. And though +36% DPS from burn is cool, it doesn't significantly impact training DPS unless you go out of your way to abuse it. Plus you also have Torpedo which is 780% - which I personally would opt for as a mobbing skill over extra Amp.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Takebacker - 2008-12-30

Now you freaking see why i suggested amp instead of torpedo? >_>

The +200% stacking with the skill i already told you guys a WHILE back. You don't remember that? o.o

Epic edit @ saph:

Kazoo Wrote:Saph reminds me of a groundhog sometimes O.o

pops out randomly with a surprise

but it's math

I wonder if the Pirates patch woulda been delayed if saph saw his shadow...

BAHAHAHA.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Russt - 2008-12-30

takebacker Wrote:epic edit @ saph:



Bahahaha.
whar.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - ItzTaylor - 2008-12-30

I don't see why you wouldn't max Ice Splitter still. :X

You say it's only extra damage. Isn't that a good thing?

You will use Ice Splitter alot, even as a Corsair to freeze monsters so your Battleship does not break as easily. Even when you freeze monsters, you want to get in as much damage as possible.

What else would you put the extra points in? LolFlameThrower?

W/e I guess that's why you can make your own decisions in life. :f6:

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Takebacker - 2008-12-30

ItzTaylor Wrote:You say it's only extra damage. Isn't that a good thing?

Normally, sure.

ItzTaylor Wrote:You will use Ice Splitter alot, even as a Corsair to freeze monsters so your Battleship does not break as easily. Even when you freeze monsters, you want to get in as much damage as possible.

I'm sure that extra 10/8% damage will do amazing things to your damage on monsters. Tongue

ItzTaylor Wrote:What else would you put the extra points in? LolFlameThrower?

What else would you put the extra points in? LolGaviota?

ItzTaylor Wrote:W/e I guess that's why you can make your own decisions in life. :f6:

By the way, your avatar is one of the funniest things i've seen in a while. Biggrin

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - ItzTaylor - 2008-12-31

How dare you butcher my post like that! Frown

Warning: Don't Open! Contains too much truth!
 Spoiler


Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Potora - 2008-12-31

ItzTaylor Wrote:How dare you butcher my post like that! Frown

Warning: Don't Open! Contains too much truth!
 Spoiler

Lmao Nice! Biggrin Rolleyes

I'm doing max flamethrower instead of gaviota though. The bird is too random. I'll get to lv 15 so I can get air strike and that's all. Plus I've never been to himes. OOOH flamethrower should be pretty there. Glitter

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Dusk - 2008-12-31

ItzTaylor Wrote:How dare you butcher my post like that! Frown

Warning: Don't Open! Contains too much truth!
 Spoiler

Well done, good show, and all that. I must say, I'm totally convinced now.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Takebacker - 2008-12-31

ItzTaylor Wrote:How dare you butcher my post like that! Frown

Warning: Don't Open! Contains too much truth!
 Spoiler

Well, there goes my arguments.

Gonna go cry myself to sleep over this loss.

Brb.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Russt - 2008-12-31

Dusk Wrote:Well done, good show, and all that. I must say, I'm totally convinced now.
Proof by repetition. It's fail-safe.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Lerk - 2008-12-31

ItzTaylor Wrote:How dare you butcher my post like that! Frown

Warning: Don't Open! Contains too much truth!
 Spoiler

Overflow error: You have now proven Flamethrower > Gaviota.

Have a nice day.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Kaasoljoyyx - 2008-12-31

Like I said, and I'm pretty sure other corsair's will agree with me on the following points:

- You only use canon, torpedo, ice splitter, and rapid fire as your main attacking skills, almost nothing else

- Besides torpedo, you're pretty much screwed on mob skills

- Octo/Air strike usually aggro monsters towards you and this is really bad at skeles when you're attacking a mob on say --> side, and some skeles come from <-- side and start attacking you, making you stop, freeze them, re-freeze the original mob, then kill both at once while your summons are aggroing more monsters for you to deal with. I can only assume gaviota will do the same

The extra few 1000's of damage won't make a huge difference for 15 vs 30 gaviota in your training speed. Max FT vs 11 FT gives you another mob skill to use which can be beneficial. You'll never use 11 FT anyway so you'll have to put those points somewhere else while max FT actually has a purpose. The purpose for gaviota can be fulfilled by level 15 OR 30 gaviota.

Flamethrower verse Gaviota - Takebacker - 2008-12-31

Kaasoljoyyx Wrote:Like I said, and I'm pretty sure other corsair's will agree with me on the following points:

- You only use canon, torpedo, ice splitter, and rapid fire as your main attacking skills, almost nothing else

- Besides torpedo, you're pretty much screwed on high target mob skills

- Octo/Air strike usually aggro monsters towards you and this is really bad at skeles when you're attacking a mob on say --> side, and some skeles come from <-- side and start attacking you, making you stop, freeze them, re-freeze the original mob, then kill both at once while your summons are aggroing more monsters for you to deal with. I can only assume gaviota will do the same

The extra few 1000's of damage won't make a huge difference for 15 vs 30 gaviota in your training speed. Max FT vs 11 FT gives you another mob skill to use which can be beneficial. You'll never use 11 FT anyway so you'll have to put those points somewhere else while max FT actually has a purpose. The purpose for gaviota can be fulfilled by level 15 OR 30 gaviota.

I'm not a corsair in GMS, but i agree and you are correct. Fixed that second one a bit. Excellent