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Kaiser's % ATK buff - Printable Version

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Kaiser's % ATK buff - JoeTang - 2013-01-06

Total Damage does show up in range.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - ShinkuDragon - 2013-01-06

JoeTang Wrote:Total Damage does show up in range.
not all sources though which is the issue.
Sorien Wrote:Wait, I thought that %Att increases the character's attack based on their current weapon/magic attack, but with the way people are talking it sounds like %Att actually increases the character's overall damage range based on their current damage instead.

Was I wrong, or does %Att increase the character's weapon/magic attack?

you're not wrong, it's just that due to the way the formula's made, the end result is the same.

(str*4+dex)*attk=damage.

(str*4+dex)*attk*1.09=damage*1.09

Kaiser's % ATK buff - JoeTang - 2013-01-06

ShinkuDragon Wrote:not all sources though which is the issue.

Hm. Well, I'm fairly sure they've fixed this in KMS at least.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - ShinkuDragon - 2013-01-06

JoeTang Wrote:Hm. Well, I'm fairly sure they've fixed this in KMS at least.

if that's true i'll be PRETTY PISSED.

question, which i'm sure you don't know, but eeh, for anyone that does. if i have a 2m-2m range WITH a %damage boost (say, berzerk 1.8), can my damage increase still by getting better equips, or not?

edit:derpquoted everyone for some reason

Kaiser's % ATK buff - Thorr - 2013-01-07

JoeTang Wrote:Hm. Well, I'm fairly sure they've fixed this in KMS at least.

OT - Total Damage from a weapon potential will not show in Range in GMS. Total damage from a Skill will show, such as BaM Dark Aura or other effects, both passive and active.

Sidenote - Personally, I cannot seem to make my calculated range match my display range with my Luminous. The displayed range is always higher than what I calculate. I strip down to nothing for equipment and disable all my card sets. It has led me to question whether Shining Rod actually has a multiplier of 1. I check the numbers when logging in fresh so that none of the buffs are in effect either (so no Sunfire/Eclipse, no Black Blessing, Lunar Tide is on Crit mode, etc.) I seem to be calculating about 15-18% lower than my displayed range. I have tried using %damage to make up the number, adding attack, adding to the multiplier, etc. I still haven't found what I am missing.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - JoeTang - 2013-01-07

Thorr Wrote:OT - Total Damage from a weapon potential will not show in Range in GMS. Total damage from a Skill will show, such as BaM Dark Aura or other effects, both passive and active.

Sidenote - Personally, I cannot seem to make my calculated range match my display range with my Luminous. The displayed range is always higher than what I calculate. I strip down to nothing for equipment and disable all my card sets. It has led me to question whether Shining Rod actually has a multiplier of 1. I check the numbers when logging in fresh so that none of the buffs are in effect either (so no Sunfire/Eclipse, no Black Blessing, Lunar Tide is on Crit mode, etc.) I seem to be calculating about 15-18% lower than my displayed range. I have tried using %damage to make up the number, adding attack, adding to the multiplier, etc. I still haven't found what I am missing.

Character card comes to mind.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - Thorr - 2013-01-07

JoeTang Wrote:Character card comes to mind.

Came to my mind too, which is why I mentioned that I removed them all before trying. (I literally took all the cards out of all the decks so there would be no bonuses at all.) That was the culprit when I had trouble calc'ing for my Evan, so I remembered to account for it this time around. (frustrating!!!!)

Kaiser's % ATK buff - JoeTang - 2013-01-07

Thorr Wrote:Came to my mind too, which is why I mentioned that I removed them all before trying. (I literally took all the cards out of all the decks so there would be no bonuses at all.) That was the culprit when I had trouble calc'ing for my Evan, so I remembered to account for it this time around. (frustrating!!!!)

My bad. fmoaingfdiandgfn It's too early for me.

+10 MATK from Spell Mastery
+30 MATK from 3 orbs on Bless of Darkness
+30 MATK from Magic Mastery
+MATK from Blessing

Kaiser's % ATK buff - Thorr - 2013-01-07

JoeTang Wrote:My bad. fmoaingfdiandgfn It's too early for me.

+10 MATK from Spell Mastery
+100% MATK from 3 orbs on Bless of Darkness
+30 MATK from Magic Mastery

Black Blessing is off, so that is discounted, but I do account for the rest.

After correcting a mistake I had (I was accounting for 5% damage from Affinity, but that is only applied to light.dark spells and not to range), I discover that I am EXACTLY off by 20% Total Damage. I don't know where this is coming from.

If I make the Shining Rod multiplier be 1.2, I get the right number (or if I use a 20% Total Damage bonus I get the perfect number also.)

The Luminous passives that I am accounting for are -
Inner Light (20 INT)
affinity (no effect on range, but considered)
Black Blessing (not active so no effect on range)
Spell Mastery (10 MA)
High Wisdom (40 INT)
Magic Mastery (30 MA)
Hyper Int (50 int)

My INT and LUK match my displayed totals (base and bonus accounted separately). My total MA calcs like this -
Weapon - 23
Will of the Alliance - 5
Empress blessing - 26
Spell Mastery - 10
Magic Mastery - 30

Total - 94

Formula for my range: 1* ((4*982)+28) * (94/100)) = 3718
20% Total Damage added = 4462 (matches my displayed range)

So, I am off exactly 20%. This makes me think I am missing a skill in my calculation somewhere (or the Rod multiplier is 1.2).

Kaiser's % ATK buff - JoeTang - 2013-01-07

Thorr Wrote:Black Blessing is off, so that is discounted, but I do account for the rest.

After correcting a mistake I had (I was accounting for 5% damage from Affinity, but that is only applied to light.dark spells and not to range), I discover that I am EXACTLY off by 20% Total Damage. I don't know where this is coming from.

If I make the Shining Rod multiplier be 1.2, I get the right number (or if I use a 20% Total Damage bonus I get the perfect number also.)

The Luminous passives that I am accounting for are -
Inner Light (20 INT)
affinity (no effect on range, but considered)
Black Blessing (not active so no effect on range)
Spell Mastery (10 MA)
High Wisdom (40 INT)
Magic Mastery (30 MA)
Hyper Int (50 int)

My INT and LUK match my displayed totals (base and bonus accounted separately). My total MA calcs like this -
Weapon - 23
Will of the Alliance - 5
Empress blessing - 26
Spell Mastery - 10
Magic Mastery - 30

Total - 94

Formula for my range: 1* ((4*982)+28) * (94/100)) = 3718
20% Total Damage added = 4462 (matches my displayed range)

So, I am off exactly 20%. This makes me think I am missing a skill in my calculation somewhere (or the Rod multiplier is 1.2).

The multiplier must have changed somewhere, either in KMS and they added it earlier in GMS, or in GMS exclusively. I'll test it with my Luminous later today.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - Thorr - 2013-01-07

JoeTang Wrote:The multiplier must have changed somewhere, either in KMS and they added it earlier in GMS, or in GMS exclusively. I'll test it with my Luminous later today.

I just made a brand new Lumi and my calculation comes out correct. There MUST be a skill I am missing for that 20%. The multiplier for Rod is definitely 1. (My calc still had the 20% bonus in it. It doesn't actually match.)

Kaiser's % ATK buff - JoeTang - 2013-01-07

Thorr Wrote:I just made a brand new Lumi and my calculation comes out correct. There MUST be a skill I am missing for that 20%. The multiplier for Rod is definitely 1.

Lunar Tide might be incorrectly active.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - Thorr - 2013-01-07

JoeTang Wrote:Lunar Tide might be incorrectly active.

I just went through and checked that, too. With Lunar Tide on Crit mode, my range shows 4462. When I switch it to Damage mode, my Range changes to 5354 (which is 4462 x 1.2). So, if it is incorrectly added, then it seems to be added once passively and then a second time actively.

I have been plying through the Luminous skill tables to see if there may be a hidden bonus in there, but I cannot find one. I may take this tester Lumi and play it a little while just to see when the range changes.

EDIT - I have a LUMI at lvl 62. His Lunar Tide is only at lvl 6 (which is a 6% damage bonus). I calculate his damage to be exactly 20% lower than his displayed range too. (unlike the lvl 11 lumi whose clac'ed number came out identical.)

EDIT 2 - I WAS WRONG!!!! On the fresh lvl 11 Lumi, my calculated damage is indeed 20% lower than the visible range:
INT - 84 (63 Base + 20 from Inner Light +1 from codex)
LUK - 5 (4 Base + 1 from Codex)
MA - 49 (23 from weapon, 26 from Empress Blessing)

Calc'ed range: (1* ((4*84)+5) * (49/100)) = 167
Dispayed range: 50 ~ 201

So, unless there is a native passive skill I am missing that gives Lumi a 20% damage bonus, the multiplier for Shining Rod must be 1.2x.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - ShinkuDragon - 2013-01-07

Thorr Wrote:OT - Total Damage from a weapon potential will not show in Range in GMS. Total damage from a Skill will show, such as BaM Dark Aura or other effects, both passive and active.

Sidenote - Personally, I cannot seem to make my calculated range match my display range with my Luminous. The displayed range is always higher than what I calculate. I strip down to nothing for equipment and disable all my card sets. It has led me to question whether Shining Rod actually has a multiplier of 1. I check the numbers when logging in fresh so that none of the buffs are in effect either (so no Sunfire/Eclipse, no Black Blessing, Lunar Tide is on Crit mode, etc.) I seem to be calculating about 15-18% lower than my displayed range. I have tried using %damage to make up the number, adding attack, adding to the multiplier, etc. I still haven't found what I am missing.

just pointing out though, ages ago i checked and BaM aura was actually %attack, rather than %damage, since it stacked additively with echo. just leaving that here.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - Thorr - 2013-01-07

ShinkuDragon Wrote:just pointing out though, ages ago i checked and BaM aura was actually %attack, rather than %damage, since it stacked additively with echo. just leaving that here.

You are correct. I meant to say Battle Mastery.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - JoeTang - 2013-01-07

ShinkuDragon Wrote:just pointing out though, ages ago i checked and BaM aura was actually %attack, rather than %damage, since it stacked additively with echo. just leaving that here.

As far as I know right now, everything stacks multiplicatively on your range in GMS, which is wrong. This is most notable with Angelic Buster where she has tons of different +Total Damage% effects. When you get to 4th job, Affinity IV activating will 1.5x your range or whatever the hell the boost is, even though you already have like 60% total damage. Soul Contract does the same thing where it doubled your visible range but was actually only a +100% Total damage increase. They've fixed this in Unlimited, where multiple sources of Total Damage will correctly stack additively in your range instead of multiplicatively. I do believe Dark Aura is +Attack% though and not Total Damage%.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - ShinkuDragon - 2013-01-07

JoeTang Wrote:As far as I know right now, everything stacks multiplicatively on your range in GMS, which is wrong. This is most notable with Angelic Buster where she has tons of different +Total Damage% effects. When you get to 4th job, Affinity IV activating will 1.5x your range or whatever the hell the boost is, even though you already have like 60% total damage. Soul Contract does the same thing where it doubled your visible range but was actually only a +100% Total damage increase. They've fixed this in Unlimited, where multiple sources of Total Damage will correctly stack additively in your range instead of multiplicatively. I do believe Dark Aura is +Attack% though and not Total Damage%.

you mean the range window right? as in the range window displays something but your damage is actually what it's supposed to be?

i haven't seen anything like that, but dang if that's true that's annoying for calculations, we'll have to see when buster comes and calmly or one of these guys can check.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - MuscleWizard - 2013-01-07

gonna take some screenshots of my range to collect some data since, y'know, i have that 21% att emblem he was talking about. let's find out if it's multiplicitave or additive.

it appears to be multiplicative.

screenshots forthcoming

Kaiser's % ATK buff - MuscleWizard - 2013-01-07

Clean Range (24762~27396)
 Spoiler

21% ATT Emblem equipped (30195~33432)
 Spoiler

Catalyze Active, Emblem Unequipped (32190~35614)
 Spoiler

Catalyze Active, Emblem Equipped (39253~43461)
 Spoiler



Emblem Equipped: 33432/27396 = 1.2203241349102058694699956197985
about right, considering as how it adds base stats as well

Catalyze Active, Emblem Unequipped: 35614/27396 = 1.2999707986567382099576580522704
About right, considering as how nothing is exact, and it's close enough to be unnoticable.

Catalyze Active, Emblem Equipped: 43461/27396 = 1.5863994743758212877792378449409

1.21*1.3=1.573

.21+.3=.51


There you have it folks, %ATT from skills stacks multiplicatively with %ATT from equips.

Kaiser's % ATK buff - ShinkuDragon - 2013-01-07

MuscleWizard Wrote:Clean Range (24762~27396)
 Spoiler

21% ATT Emblem equipped (30195~33432)
 Spoiler

Catalyze Active, Emblem Unequipped (32190~35614)
 Spoiler

Catalyze Active, Emblem Equipped (39253~43461)
 Spoiler



Emblem Equipped: 33432/27396 = 1.2203241349102058694699956197985
about right, considering as how it adds base stats as well

Catalyze Active, Emblem Unequipped: 35614/27396 = 1.2999707986567382099576580522704
About right, considering as how nothing is exact, and it's close enough to be unnoticable.

Catalyze Active, Emblem Equipped: 43461/27396 = 1.5863994743758212877792378449409

1.21*1.3=1.573

.21+.3=.51


There you have it folks, %ATT from skills stacks multiplicatively with %ATT from equips.
think you could try it with echo?