Proving that Jesus didn't get crucified.

For those interested, try to find "Flavius Josephus' report about Joseph of Arimathea's letter in extenso", translated from Greek to English by Geoffrey C. Gallborough.

To understand the letter, you have to understand what position Pontius Pilatus (Pilate) was in.

Then the Pharisees went and plotted how to entangle him in his words. And they sent their disciples to him, along with the Herodians, saying, "Teacher, we know that you are true and teach the way of God truthfully, and you do not care about anyone’s opinion, for you are not swayed by appearances. Tell us, then, what you think. Is it lawful to pay taxes to Caesar, or not?" But Jesus, aware of their malice, said, "Why put me to the test, you hypocrites? Show me the coin for the tax." And they brought him a denarius. And Jesus said to them, "Whose likeness and inscription is this?" They said, "Caesar’s." Then he said to them, "Therefore render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s." When they heard it, they marveled. And they left him and went away.

Probably the most cleverest answer due to Jesus' position. If he had said no, he would be hated by the Romans. If he would have said yes, then he would end up in trouble with Jewish groups that hated the Romans. Especially the zealots. Still, the answer Jesus gave wasn't good enough for the zealots, it kinda sounded like "Pay the tax". Now he ended up in problems with another group of Jews, the first group wanted to get rid of him due to the fact that he called himself Messiah, and thus was a threat against their own power. This put Pilatus in a hard position, because the biggest issue the Romans had with the Jews was exactly that; the taxes. And here you have this Jew that is saying that people should pay taxes to the Roman Empire? If he killed Jesus, then he would have a chance of being accused for duty-failure (Sorry my bad English, lol.). If not, he would have a major issue keeping peace in Judea. Hey, two powerful groups of Jews wanted Jesus dead. Now Pilatus was forced to accuse and then execute a Jew that supported taxes to the Roman Empire to keep the peace. Sounds fair enough, this is what has been written in the Bible.

The letter I've been talking about proves that Joseph of Arimathea protected Joshua (aka Jesus) from getting crucified. It states "... and two legionnaires arranged a crucification of three unclean, violent men. The Jews thought one of these was Joshua of Nazareth. I alone took hand over the anointed, who we kept hidden..."

Oh, and the source of this letter is from Herculaneum, Villa of the Papyri. Witnesses for this was Joseph of Arimathea and Longinus. Yep, under the ashes. More about this here.

Sadly enough, I have only the Norwegian version available as of right now. Knut Kleve and Brynjulf Fosse thought it was a good idea to keep the Norwegian version available at the Norwegian University's "Main" Library. This isn't proof enough unless I manage to locate this guy Geoffrey C. Gallborough's translations, and find his version. So! I need halp. Do anyone know where I can locate this letter?

dang. thats interesting.

doesn't the crucifixion of Jesus deal with Pilate giving the Jews permission to crucify? and his authority great back then, so nobody could challenge it?

and yes Joseph of Arimathea is the one who buried Jesus, so i think he was crucified before, but his body might be another story

"who we kept hidden...?" Where? What you have written there isn't conclusive. It doesn't say "we protected Jesus", just "we took him". Nowhere does it say there that he was protected from crucifixion. Also, Arimethia took Jesus's body into the tomb. I'd like to see more from this document. Sounds interesting, if what you say is true.

"who we kept hidden...?" Where? What you have written there isn't conclusive. It doesn't say "we protected Jesus", just "we took him". Nowhere does it say there that he was protected from crucifixion. Also, Arimethia took Jesus's body into the tomb. I'd like to see more from this document. Sounds interesting, if what you say is true.

I realized I took it out of context when you pointed it out. Thanks. I'm not the one to ask for translations however! as I currently haven't got any Norwegian-English books to translate with, and the letter contains a lot of words I'm not commonly using in English. But, I'll try.

 Spoiler

I, Joseph of Arimathea, had to flee from my own country after, with help from the wise prefect in the Roman province Judea, Pontius Pilatus, had saved my spiritual brother (*), Joshua(1) of Nazareth, the anointed from a horrible fate. The Jewish priesthood alleged by Yakup Isalia and Shimon of Qumran wanted this God's disciple raised on a cross and blood-drained. This was a verdict (*) the prefect did not like, and together we got, with use of the golden shields (2) of Herodes Antipas and two legionnaires (3) arranged a crucifixion of three unclean men. The Jews thought that one of these was Joshua of Nazareth. I alone got to take hand over the anointed, who we kept hidden in my tomb until the crucified's death could be preached for the Jewish Council, confirmed by the legionnaire who kept guard by the crosses.
The Nazarene was secretly at night moved to his hideout, where he was some days, and promised when the time is right and after taking farewell with his pregnant wife and belief brothers(*), to travel alone in loneliness and anger to his fine-place(*) east for the great river Naher Dija (4). The rabbi's sorrow was great over falling from ungrace with his Jewish brothers.
Men neither I could stay in Judea after this incident, and since I had good connections in the Gallic part of the Roman Empire, we decided to travel over the ocean. Again was the wise prefect Pontius Pilatus helping us. He got us a boat, and during the trip gave Joshua's wife, Mary of Magdala, birth to a girl who got the name Sara. The trip took 3 years, since we for a long time lived at an island named Coriti(5) where we met a hospitable population. We reached Gallia in good condition, and Mary of Magdala, her brother Lazarus and the daughter Sara found a safe residence in Pons Ubria(6), while I continued north in the country to the city Venniae(7). Here I sit with my good friend, the prefect Pontius Pilatus, who got relegated here after Vitelius, the Roman legacies in Syria had complained that he misused Qorba (8), an allegation which is deeply unfair. He orders me to write down the story about the Nazarene Joshua and send this to you, Yosef Ben Matitjahu, in the great imperator Nero Claudius Caesar's 4th year.

(1): Joshua = Jesus
(2): It's aimed towards some shields which the Jews found violating, but the context here is unclear.
(3): One of these was Longinus
(4): Possibly Tigris.
(5): Crete
(6): This place is unknown, but it could have been Camargue, west for Marseilles.
(7): Vienna = Vienne, city in France, about 30 kilometres south of Lyon.
(8): Qorba, or korban, is the name on the temple's divine treasures.
(*): Prolly bad/horrible translation.
Note: This is only Joseph of Arimathea's letter to Flavius Josephus. Not the whole letter which he wrote. I'll maybe add it in tomorrow.

As a Muslim, I naturally dont believe Jesus was crucified to begin with.

As a Muslim, I naturally dont believe Jesus was crucified to begin with.

Wait..
I thought Muslims just thought Jesus was a Prophet- not the Son of God-
*asks Muslim friend*
Ya he said that Jesus was crucified.:f6:
mmm....
Religious conflict.

And since when does one letter override numerous eyewitness accounts?

And since when does one letter override numerous eyewitness accounts?

IN THE COURT ROOM!!

Wait..
I thought Muslims just thought Jesus was a Prophet- not the Son of God-
*asks Muslim friend*
Ya he said that Jesus was crucified.:f6:
mmm....
Religious conflict.

I think it's more like they think he died on that cross, and didn't "suddenly" turn alive like the Bible tells.

And since when does one letter override numerous eyewitness accounts?

Well, this is somewhat like the director of Harry Houdini's show explaining one of Houdini's tricks, if you read my post.

^ Okay, so if I wrote a letter saying, "JFK didn't die. That was a decoy. I hid the real JFK, and he's in my basement eating asparagus right now," how would that be any different?

^ Okay, so if I wrote a letter saying, "JFK didn't die. That was a decoy. I hid the real JFK, and he's in my basement eating asparagus right now," how would that be any different?

Because we "know" that Joseph of Arimathea lent his land and tomb for Jesus and his crucifixion. We "know" that Pontius Pilate ordered Jesus's crucifixion, and we "know" that Longinus was the one who pierced Jesus with a spear. If all those admit that Jesus did not die on the cross, it would be equivalent with a letter with JFK's driver, Nellie Connally and Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis all stating that the person who was killed was not JFK.