Elemental Staves & Wands Known Issue

I don't give a pomegranate about mages as a class either way, or the history of them. I people say mages are inferior they have no idea what they are talking about. Power is now only a question of potential stats so why should there be an item that hugely bolster that power further for just a fraction of the different classes? Mages do not NEED the elemental weapons, they just need to shell out money on potential like the rest of us if they feel like competing with the top tier. I do feel that they should have handled the nerf way better since it was kind of out of the blue, but if they get compensated in an appropriate fashion then it is all well and good. Either way the nerf is not some kind of diabolic stroke designed to smite the magicians. It is a stroke to the players that paid money for the weapons, but nothing more, nothing less. The weapons are still superior to what the rest of the classes can get, even without the precious elemental boost, so while it might be annoying, it is not what some call destroying the class. It is not even close to the end of mage prowess, it is just the end of getting it much cheaper than most other classes. I suppose it is also the end of the few mages with a high level of potential stats from being way too overpowered.
Also Mr. MissingLink, me being a NL has nothing to do with anything, I have nothing against any particular class. I disslike imbalance as a concept though and I enjoy seeing it fixed. Granted, an illconceived method, but a fix still.

if you dont give a hoot about mages then dont post here. stop b'awwwww-ing over mages who actually want and can achieve the same amount of power NLs have.

Mages do not NEED the elemental weapons, they just need to shell out money on potential like the rest of us if they feel like competing with the top tier.

Right. Because clearly having spent $1200 or so to acquire my staves is entirely indicative that I've not spent nearly as much as the rest of you did on potential and should spend more to make myself equal. Again.

It is a stroke to the players that paid money for the weapons, but nothing more, nothing less.

Did I miss the day every archmage was just handed an elemental wand and staff like they were candy? Or the day they became so common place every mage could pick one up for the same price everyone else picks up their weapons before potentialing them?

It's like you have some bizarre double standard here where money and time spent on a weapon only counts if it wasn't an elemental wand/stave.
For mages these were the original potential item. How would you feel if in six months Nexon took off everything potentialled for just your class and told you if you wanted it back you'd have to buy a shiny new form of it from the cash shop so you can be like everyone else?

Right. Because clearly having spent $1200 or so to acquire my staves is entirely indicative that I've not spent nearly as much as the rest of you did on potential and should spend more to make myself equal. Again.
Did I miss the day every archmage was just handed an elemental wand and staff like they were candy? Or the day they became so common place every mage could pick one up for the same price everyone else picks up their weapons before potentialing them?

It's like you have some bizarre double standard here where money and time spent on a weapon only counts if it wasn't an elemental wand/stave.

I was speaking about balance here. The nerf was right, but not without compensation. And while not growing on trees, they were immensely cheaper than any other weapon adding that kind of oomph. To achieve a 20% boost to other classes damage would take alot more than a few hundred millions, not to mention the weapons themselves aint excatly small fry in power. You get me wrong if you think I feel like every mage somehow deserved this because they are mages. I feel sad for the people that, like yourself, paid a good deal for them, but I do not feel anything towards the mages as a whole. I'd gladly sign any petiton to get you guys refunded in full.

I was speaking about balance here. The nerf was right, but not without compensation. And while not growing on trees, they were immensely cheaper than any other weapon adding that kind of oomph. To achieve a 20% boost to other classes damage would take alot more than a few hundred millions, not to mention the weapons themselves aint excatly small fry in power. You get me wrong if you think I feel like every mage somehow deserved this because they are mages. I feel sad for the people that, like yourself, paid a good deal for them, but I do not feel anything towards the mages as a whole. I'd gladly sign any petiton to get you guys refunded in full.

you keep talking about how hard it is for other classes to get a 1.25x boost in their damage. did you forget the whole point of that 1.25 for mages is to CATCH UP... whats the freaking point if other classes have the same 1.25x ? its gonna be the same all over again.

you keep talking about how hard it is for other classes to get a 1.25x boost in their damage. did you forget the whole point of that 1.25 for mages is to CATCH UP... whats the freaking point if other classes have the same 1.25x ? its gonna be the same all over again.

That was pre-BB. KMS redesigned Arch Mages without considering EWands since they don't have them.

lets say you wake up one day your main skill (bliz) has a cooldow, so that it's useless, and your 2nd main attack skill cl went from hitting 6 to just hitting 3. and now what is supposed to be your main skill big bang is lighting base so you can't use it with your other skill , and you have to charged which you can't teleport while holding the charged down and if you get hit it become inactive. and last they took away your elemental bonus, with bad maps/exp to train on and the removal of 2exp cards, what is a mage do..

That was pre-BB. KMS redesigned Arch Mages without considering EWands since they don't have them.

honestly, i dont really think big bang helped mages in moving up the dps chart. i mean, they do a whole lot more damage now, but still, last compared to other classes...

lets say you wake up one day your main skill (bliz) has a cooldow, so that it's useless, and your 2nd main attack skill cl went from hitting 6 to just hitting 3. and now what is supposed to be your main skill big bang is lighting base so you can't use it with your other skill , and you have to charged which you can't teleport while holding the charged down and if you get hit it become inactive. and last they took away your elemental bonus, with bad maps/exp to train on and the removal of 2exp cards, what is a mage do..

big bang needs some tweaking to be a better training skill. also... having big bang be main element for two mages and not for i/l is just... >___>

honestly, i dont really think big bang helped mages in moving up the dps chart. i mean, they do a whole lot more damage now, but still, last...

The thing is, your damage is no longer tied entirely to your class. Even if we score low on charts we can still out damage other classes, without the additional multiplier, if we're smart with our equips.

I was speaking about balance here. The nerf was right, but not without compensation. And while not growing on trees, they were immensely cheaper than any other weapon adding that kind of oomph. To achieve a 20% boost to other classes damage would take alot more than a few hundred millions, not to mention the weapons themselves aint excatly small fry in power. You get me wrong if you think I feel like every mage somehow deserved this because they are mages. I feel sad for the people that, like yourself, paid a good deal for them, but I do not feel anything towards the mages as a whole. I'd gladly sign any petiton to get you guys refunded in full.

That's the problem, there is no balance with removing the % bonus from elemental weapons while leaving the potential system in place.

Potential System = Advantages resulting from a majority of nx($$$)/in game currency.
Elemental Weapons = Minimal advantages resulting from a majority of in game currency/nx.

Both are available only to players with the appropiate funding.

Connections aside, if just by having an elemental weapon made a host for a boss run pick an evan over a funded nl, then I would
agree with nexon's reasoning for the announcement.

big bang needs some tweaking to be a better training skill. also... having big bang be main element for two mages and not for i/l is just... >___>

Agreed, I train faster with chain lightning than big bang. =/

I don't give a pomegranate about mages as a class either way, or the history of them. I people say mages are inferior they have no idea what they are talking about.

As a mage, I feel insulted that someone would insult my intelect and knowledge that I have on my own class.

Power is now only a question of potential stats so why should there be an item that hugely bolster that power further for just a fraction of the different classes?

So everything is based on a broken NX based system. It would be the same with or without the Elemental Wand/Staff bonus.
It also sounds like you support the idea of "paying nexon to get stronger." News Flash; Elemental Wands and Staves are Gachapon only. People had to pay nexon for them, just like how people paid nexon for the potential system.

Mages do not NEED the elemental weapons, they just need to shell out money on potential like the rest of us if they feel like competing with the top tier.

And you dont need a claw. you could do some damage and play with stabbing snails with a dagger. You'd do less damage, you'd take longer to level up and kill bosses, but you'd get there eventually.

I do feel that they should have handled the nerf way better since it was kind of out of the blue, but if they get compensated in an appropriate fashion then it is all well and good.

I dont see how "handling it better" would have made a difference in giving the middle finger to your customers.

Either way the nerf is not some kind of diabolic stroke designed to smite the magicians. It is a stroke to the players that paid money for the weapons, but nothing more, nothing less.

"Stroke" doesnt sound like the appropriate word. I'd call it fucking your customers in the pimento. And I dont see how defrauding your customers out of what they paid for can be justified.

The weapons are still superior to what the rest of the classes can get, even without the precious elemental boost,

A mage's weapon multiplier disagrees. On top of that it is taking away one of the bonuses mages had outside of KMS while leaving many advantages that other classes had from content not found in KMS.
Warriors still benefit from weapons faster than those found in KMS.
Night Lords benefit from the extremely powerful Watt potions and stars not found in KMS.
Bandits benefit from a 15 base Watt shield not found in KMS
All Watt classes benefit more than mages from the MoN, not found in KMS.

And this is only the tip of the iceberg. Many would debate that Mages need the elemental bonus just to compete with all the advantages other classes get that are not from KMS.

so while it might be annoying, it is not what some call destroying the class.

You try having the effects of your equipment that you paid for and/or earned stolen from from you. Its more than annoying. Its infuriating.
While it isnt destroying the class, this act is definitly fucking over paying customers.

It is not even close to the end of mage prowess, it is just the end of getting it much cheaper than most other classes. I suppose it is also the end of the few mages with a high level of potential stats from being way too overpowered.

I suppose we could be getting a pretty cheap and powerful bonuses from the wands/staffs if you ignore other content (lets say... extremely cheap 50% scrolls) that GMS has that KMS doesnt.

Also Mr. MissingLink, me being a NL has nothing to do with anything, I have nothing against any particular class. I disslike imbalance as a concept though and I enjoy seeing it fixed. Granted, an illconceived method, but a fix still.

Funny how you say that you dislike imbalance, but also promote the idea of just using the broken potential system.

People, the potential system is unbalancing between people with money and people without, not between classes, so stop brining it up like it is the same thing. Broken or not, it is an entirely different subject.

@ Anonymous Moose:
Your breaking down of my post serves absolutely nothing with your comments so full of rage and exagerations. Chill down and take a deep breath.


Since noone is interested in a clinical debate about this, I'll just stop posting. I do not really feel like contributing to this rage fest anymore, because regardless of what it seems like, I aint here to piss people off.

People, the potential system is unbalancing between people with money and people without, not between classes, so stop brining it up like it is the same thing. Broken or not, it is an entirely different subject.

Wrong. The potential system favours classes with Tops/Bottoms that are level 70+ and classes that are use one handed weapons. Specifically Pirates and Bowmen are the classes that benefit the least from the system (both are two handed and have only viable end game overalls).

Edit: You could make a debate with the stirgeman equipment, but good luck obtaining that equipment. If you are a mage you would miss out on int scrolls.

@ Anonymous Moose:
Your breaking down of my post serves absolutely nothing with your comments so full of rage and exagerations. Chill down and take a deep breath.

Stop exagerating the effects of the elemental wands and staves when compared to the advantages of other class' equipment and I'll consider it.

Actually the potential system is more funded inclined Moose. When potential gear first arrived everyone who had items scrolled for ATT and M.ATT and were selling them were almost put out of business.

Look at how much % based Unique Potential gear goes for. Some of the rarest and highest potential gear goes for upwards of 9 billion mesos of which a 3x 6% All Stat Deep Purple Witch Belt. You say it's favored only to top/bottom wearing classes? Actually every class has the ability to wear top/bottom of level 70+ even if limited to only a certain few pieces. Then look at skill and effect potentials which are rarer and even more valuable. Most of these instantly killed the need for people to hire people like Mages for Door, Spearmen for HyperBody, Thieves for Haste, and Bowmen for Sharp Eyes.

In effect the potential system is a double edged sword. You can rarely find off the drop good potentials which can serve you well, but to get the best, well, unless you have the money to Cube stuff yourself or buy the best stuff, you're out of luck.

Has anyone ever considered that KMS didn't consider Ewands NOT because they didn't have them, but because they AREN'T something that Arch Mages needed?

Yes they exist, yes they make you stronger, but they aren't what make an Arch Mage.

If elemental wands were never created, what we would have is exactly what KMS (and GMS) currently have. Maple has been spoiled by these weapons as something they want, just to justify "we cannot train without them".

Has anyone ever considered that KMS didn't consider Ewands NOT because they didn't have them, but because they AREN'T something that Arch Mages needed?

Yes they exist, yes they make you stronger, but they aren't what make an Arch Mage.

If elemental wands were never created, what we would have is exactly what KMS (and GMS) currently have. Maple has been spoiled by these weapons as something they want, just to justify "we cannot train without them".

I agree that elemental weapons are not the answer for any balancing problems.

However, when archmages/evans were not even considered in the top 5 with elemental weapons and a mistaken +30% magic
mastery despite one branch being designed specifically as an attacking based class, it's hardly reasonable for nexon to make
such a change in the current maplestory.

Even though some state that classes are balanced in the big bang update, kms still continues to make major adjustments.
(mechanics being nerfed, the dual blade/evan changes, angel ray/chain lightning/paralyze getting % increases, snipe, ect)

When it gets to the point where elemental weapons are truly a broken factor in determing dpm, nexon can then make an announcement
for the intended bonus removals with a compensation.

Let's go with facts instead of assumptions here. These are some questions that would have to be asked before assuming anything about balance in this scenario:

1. Does the average AM out-damage the average (both with exactly the same funding), with their respective end game weapon (ele staff -with 25% bonus- being the case for the AM)? The only way to concretely answer that is by looking at an accurate DPM chart ...and we don't have access to one of those yet. F3

2. If the answer to question 1 is yes and by far (keeping in mind no one knows the answer to question 1 yet), how much is by far? 10%? 20%? Where do we draw the line at significance?

3. If the answer to question 1 is no, then there's no argument at all to get rid of the elemental bonus of these weapons.

4. Would you call hoards 50% 2-handed wep att scrolls benefiting only certain classes balanced? Don't think you would. Would you call being able to get, for instance, 30% Dex on a top+bottom, while someone else can only get 15% dex on an overall balanced? Don't think you would. The main point is that there are other factors to look at here besides delusional thinking of "OMG 25% BONUS N0 F@IR".

IMO, there's no basis to getting rid of the bonus even if the advantage archmages would have over other classes is a mere 5%, because without it, they'd be 20% weaker then everyone else. And there's no arguing that being over 20% weaker than another attacking class is blatant unbalance.

So, overall, until we accurately know the DPM of all attack-oriented classes, we can't say whether or not a 25% elemental bonus is game-breaking/unbalanced/unfair/what-have-you regardless of what NEXON AM says in their unprofessionally late notices.

Actually the potential system is more funded inclined Moose.

Assuming equal or infinite funding, it would definitly favour classes that can equip more items.

Look at how much % based Unique Potential gear goes for. Some of the rarest and highest potential gear goes for upwards of 9 billion mesos of which a 3x 6% All Stat Deep Purple Witch Belt. You say it's favored only to top/bottom wearing classes? Actually every class has the ability to wear top/bottom of level 70+ even if limited to only a certain few pieces. Then look at skill and effect potentials which are rarer and even more valuable. Most of these instantly killed the need for people to hire people like Mages for Door, Spearmen for HyperBody, Thieves for Haste, and Bowmen for Sharp Eyes.

Only? I didnt say that. I simply stated that the system favors classes that can equip more items, and as I said, good luck finding those Stirgeman items, especially if your character is female.

In effect the potential system is a double edged sword. You can rarely find off the drop good potentials which can serve you well, but to get the best, well, unless you have the money to Cube stuff yourself or buy the best stuff, you're out of luck.

This game, for a long time, has been a game where those without money are out of luck.

Has anyone ever considered that KMS didn't consider Ewands NOT because they didn't have them, but because they AREN'T something that Arch Mages needed?

Yes they exist, yes they make you stronger, but they aren't what make an Arch Mage.

If elemental wands were never created, what we would have is exactly what KMS (and GMS) currently have. Maple has been spoiled by these weapons as something they want, just to justify "we cannot train without them".

KMS and GMS are different servers and different things are necessary on each different server with their own different sets of content. Speaking of different servers, JMS decided that it was necessary to keep the Elemental bonuses.

While they dont make an AM or Evan, they are something I paid for and I expect to be able to have what I paid for.

And finally "what if's" are irrelevant.

Edit: I still want to make a point of the how ridiculous it is for Battle Mages to receive a higher DPM increase from Elemental Staves than an Arch Mage using the proper Element with their staff/wand.

Has anyone ever considered that KMS didn't consider Ewands NOT because they didn't have them, but because they AREN'T something that Arch Mages needed?

Yes they exist, yes they make you stronger, but they aren't what make an Arch Mage.

If elemental wands were never created, what we would have is exactly what KMS (and GMS) currently have. Maple has been spoiled by these weapons as something they want, just to justify "we cannot train without them".

coulda fooled me. They look like mage gear, they have colors for the kind of magic you use, and they add a nice boost, assuming the mob is elemental neutral or weak. I was fooled into thinking this really completed and complemented my build!

Actually the potential system is more funded inclined Moose. When potential gear first arrived everyone who had items scrolled for ATT and M.ATT and were selling them were almost put out of business.

Look at how much % based Unique Potential gear goes for. Some of the rarest and highest potential gear goes for upwards of 9 billion mesos of which a 3x 6% All Stat Deep Purple Witch Belt. You say it's favored only to top/bottom wearing classes? Actually every class has the ability to wear top/bottom of level 70+ even if limited to only a certain few pieces. Then look at skill and effect potentials which are rarer and even more valuable. Most of these instantly killed the need for people to hire people like Mages for Door, Spearmen for HyperBody, Thieves for Haste, and Bowmen for Sharp Eyes.

In effect the potential system is a double edged sword. You can rarely find off the drop good potentials which can serve you well, but to get the best, well, unless you have the money to Cube stuff yourself or buy the best stuff, you're out of luck.

this post speaks so much truth

off topic, but... if nexon kills the ore market im doomed ;___; its bad enough that so many merchants are giving up on scrolls and trying ores. i've already heard some doomsday news that (supposedly) they removed the need for a DC to job advance. DC's are a huge portion of the ores that actually sell on a day to day basis. hopefully the new maker system can inflate the need for others enough to make up for what a huge loss that'll be... between this and boss runs becoming limited... i'm