What a NL can expect after BB patch.

HOLY CRAP THE [BG] TAG SUCKS @@@@

Originally, I wanted to compile a list of all the prevalent changes a NL should expect after the patch goes live. Somehow I got drawn into this. Anyway, I'll edit the thread with the original information/request later, for now, if you're bored, please proofread this for me.
I'm not familiar with NL so this took quite a bit of research/organizing. Go easy on me please.

 124 NL: 679 LUK // 165 DEX // 116 + 30 (star) + 16 (BoF) = 162 ATK // TT level 10 // Adventurer Critical Ring

[header]Pre-BB:[/header]
TT damage formula: LUK * 5 * Skill% * ATK/100

Max non-crit TT10 damage: 679*5*1.2*162/100 = 6599
=> 3299~6599 TT10 range
=> AVG non-crit dmg: 4949

Max crit TT10 damage: 679*5*162*(1.2+1.1)/100 = 12649
=> 6324~12649 TT10 crit dmg
=> AVG crit dmg: 9486

=> AVG damage per star: 4949*0.4 + 9486*0.6 = 7671
=> AVG damage per TT10+SP: 7671*3*1.5 = 34519

[header]Post-BB:[/header]
- Reg Max Dmg: 1.75*(4 * LUK + DEX) * (Weapon Attack / 100)
= 1.75*(4*679 + 165)*(162/100) = 8167
=> Reg Dmg Range: 5308~8167

- Non-crit TT10 Range: A * 1.9 multiplier (TT10) * 0.9 (Mob damage penalty)
=> 5308~8167 * 1.9 * 0.9 = 9076~13965
=> AVG non-crit dmg per TT10+SP: 11521*3*1.5 = 51844

Criticals: 60% chance to do 135~150% dmg (142.5% crit dmg on average)
=> AVG crit dmg per TT10+SP: 51844*(0.65*1.425 + 0.35) = 66166

WITH SE: Average crit bonus becomes ((135 + 180)/2)% at 85% chance
=> AVG crit dmg per TT10+SP+SE: 51844*(0.85*1.575 + 0.15) = 77182.755

[imgspoiler=Click here for a summary/comparison]http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/6149/dmg.png[/imgspoiler]

=================================================================================================

 Spoiler

[header]Miscellaneous changes[/header]

1/ Shadow Shifter: +15% activation rate at all levels (1 point in SS at early NL-hood suddenly becomes useful).

2/ Shadow Resistance: +10% MaxHP(?), +20% Elemental Resistance (less dmg at Pap/HT heads)

3/ Avenger:
Damage formula change:
Old: Max = (Luk*3.6 + Dex) * (WeaponAttack / 100) = A
New: Max = 1.75*(4 * LUK + DEX) * (WeaponAttack / 100) = B
A/B = 3.6/7 (approximately; Dex didn't and won't matter significantly for a rough estimation) = 51.43%

For Avenger, not only does the SkillDamage% get boosted two-fold, your damage range also goes up twice as high, resulting in a damage output almost 4 times as high as previously is pre-BB. New Mastery is also better, 65% vs. 54%.

4/ Taunt: Since you now mob, it could be possible to integrate Taunt into your training style more fluidly.

How much DPS would the Nightlord have pre-bigbang with SE? or is that already included?

And Thorns works for all classes/stacks with SE now?

Very impressive bonus, a nearly 100% increase in DPS without SE/Thorns is nothing to look down on.

How much DPS would the Nightlord have pre-bigbang with SE? or is that already included?

And Thorns works for all classes/stacks with SE now?

Very impressive bonus, a nearly 100% increase in DPS without SE/Thorns is nothing to look down on.

I didn't include SE in pre-BB calculations (because I'm unsure my post-BB one is correct), which is why I highlighted the non-SE'd ones. I'll do it later for kicks and giggles, I guess. Currently working out the general reasonable expectations for the damage increase, since the dmg formula gets changed around a bit, this can only go by estimations.

I believe only the chance stacks, not the damage.

I wasn't expecting them to stack either way.
With Thorns30: 80% Crit chance at 150~150% Crit damage
With SE30: 80% Crit chance at 120~180% Crit damage

This is with Critical Ring btw.

And Thorns works for all classes/stacks with SE now?

I believe only the chance stacks, not the damage.

SE and Thorns boost different parts of critical damage post-BB, so I don't see why they wouldn't stack. Can't confirm though. Either way, neither skill is really worth talking about or including in your damage. It's not like pre-BB where you do 10k without SE and 15k with. Every class gets a 10~15%ish damage boost from max SE.

SE and Thorns boost different parts of critical damage post-BB, so I don't see why they wouldn't stack. Can't confirm though. Either way, neither skill is really worth talking about or including in your damage. It's not like pre-BB where you do 10k without SE and 15k with. Every class gets a 10~15%ish damage boost from max SE.

What I find more interesting is that damage becomes more stable with thorns, and the higher the critical chance, the better. My point of view would be to aim for 100% critical rate, or attempt it.

ALSO, anyone mind telling me what's decent sharp eye's effects after Big Bang?

Judging by TT's skilldamage% differences:
Old formula: (100 + level*2)% from level 1 through 20; (100 + level*2+1)% from 21 though 30.
New formula: (160 + level*3)% from level 1 through 30.

I'm generalizing that: the ratio Old:New starts out at 102/163 = 62.58% and linearly increases to 140/220 = 63.63%, then linearly decreases to 150/250 = 60%. So it's safe(?) to assume that the damage will increase to around 160% of pre-BB with just skill modification (167% dmg increase with TT30).
Combined with the change in damage formula, my example got a +80% boost with TT10 while Fiel's thread showed a good +150% boost with TT30 (+175% average damage boost due to higher mastery). That's a broad range, but at least, expect a significant increase in your damage.

NLs are fairly low on the dps charts, and nothing makes us awesome anymore SE doesn't make us throw rainbows and eating apples doesn't miracle boast us anymore. I never saw a DPS chart that uses the exact correct formulas....waiting for some people on SP to be less lazy and make one

NLs are fairly low on the dps charts, and nothing makes us awesome anymore SE doesn't make us throw rainbows and eating apples doesn't miracle boast us anymore. I never saw a DPS chart that uses the exact correct formulas....waiting for some people on SP to be less lazy and make one

Do you not notice that the example Nightlords DPS doubled post BB without SE/Thorns and with TT10? I'm pretty sure Apples mean more than before as well.

NLs are fairly low on the dps charts, and nothing makes us awesome anymore SE doesn't make us throw rainbows and eating apples doesn't miracle boast us anymore. I never saw a DPS chart that uses the exact correct formulas....waiting for some people on SP to be less lazy and make one

Apples still make NLs pretty raw considering alchemy still has their apple duration to like 15 minutes. that extra few minutes more of DPS is pretty insane.

NLs are fairly low on the dps charts, and nothing makes us awesome anymore SE doesn't make us throw rainbows and eating apples doesn't miracle boast us anymore. I never saw a DPS chart that uses the exact correct formulas....waiting for some people on SP to be less lazy and make one

What. Go get on KMS and document every new formula/skill mechanic and I'll be glad to make you a DPS chart. Most likely you'll have to wait until Big Bang hits GMS. The biggest thing to keep in mind is that with potential, the class you pick doesn't matter nearly as much as the quality of your equipment.

What. Go get on KMS and document every new formula/skill mechanic and I'll be glad to make you a DPS chart.

What are we missing? Off the top of my head, Enrage, and Dual Charge are still up in the air, and possibly Dark Force. I hate how every fucking god damn Night Lord I see argues that since SE doesn't make them do godly damage anymore, they must do pomegranate damage.

What are we missing? Off the top of my head, Enrage, and Dual Charge are still up in the air, and possibly Dark Force. I hate how every fucking god damn Night Lord I see argues that since SE doesn't make them do godly damage anymore, they must do pomegranate damage.

Still don't have a clear understanding of how DoT stacking works, PDD formula, plus a bunch of situational crap like Dodge, Counter Attack, and Infinity that make everything a hell of a lot more complicated.

NLs are fairly low on the dps charts, and nothing makes us awesome anymore SE doesn't make us throw rainbows and eating apples doesn't miracle boast us anymore. I never saw a DPS chart that uses the exact correct formulas....waiting for some people on SP to be less lazy and make one

Didn't you get fed up of being told that you were wrong the first time you tried to make everyone think that NLs were getting horribly nerfed?

Still don't have a clear understanding of how DoT stacking works, PDD formula, plus a bunch of situational crap like Dodge, Counter Attack, and Infinity that make everything a hell of a lot more complicated.

Damage over time takes your max damage and uses that with the % per second. For example, since maxed Venom does 140% of your max damage range per second.

PDD does nothing so far.

Calculating for Dodge is like calculating for the amount of time wasted when you're kbed in my opinion.

Damage over time takes your max damage and uses that with the % per second.

I know that. I'm an F/P. I kind of need to know what happens when I use Fire Demon and then Paralyze. What happens when multiple NLs are attacking the same boss? Can a boss take DoT from an unliimited number of sources? This is getting off-topic, though.

NLs are fairly low on the dps charts, and nothing makes us awesome anymore SE doesn't make us throw rainbows and eating apples doesn't miracle boast us anymore. I never saw a DPS chart that uses the exact correct formulas....waiting for some people on SP to be less lazy and make one

Didn't you get fed up of being told that you were wrong the first time you tried to make everyone think that NLs were getting horribly nerfed?

^^This

@jhkplaya888
We're not weak in the least sense of the world. Have you not seen the vids on both dojo and the NL soloing Zak WHILE hugging it's body doing insane damage. You don't give us enough credit man.

Edit: And we train faster than ever with the Avenger buff.

I know that. I'm an F/P. I kind of need to know what happens when I use Fire Demon and then Paralyze. What happens when multiple NLs are attacking the same boss? Can a boss take DoT from an unliimited number of sources? This is getting off-topic, though.

I know that a F/P can put DoT on a boss simultaniously from 5 or 6 attacks, so I'm guessing there's no problem with multiple people. It's just like multiple people attacking a boss at the same time.

Some updates, need help verifying some facts.

 Spoiler

[header]Miscellaneous changes[/header]

1/ Shadow Shifter: +15% activation rate at all levels (1 point in SS at early NL-hood suddenly becomes useful).

2/ Shadow Resistance: +10% MaxHP(?), +20% Elemental Resistance (less dmg at Pap/HT heads)

3/ Avenger:
Damage formula change:
Old: Max = (Luk*3.6 + Dex) * (WeaponAttack / 100) = A
New: Max = 1.75*(4 * LUK + DEX) * (WeaponAttack / 100) = B
A/B = 3.6/7 (approximately; Dex didn't and won't matter significantly for a rough estimation) = 51.43%

For Avenger, not only does the SkillDamage% get boosted two-fold (180% to 350%), your damage range also goes up twice as high, resulting in a damage output almost 4 times as high as previously is pre-BB. New Mastery is also better, 65% vs. 54%.

4/ Taunt: Since you now mob, it could be possible to integrate Taunt into your training style more fluidly.

5/ Dark Flare:
Level 20: "MP 100 Consumption, 60 seconds to summon dakeurodeu surigeom windmills, and 1300% of damage reflected, 60 seconds cooldown"
What the pineapple does this skill do? How do you use it?

6/ Experienced -gibberish-: "Lucky Seven, drain, eobenjyeo, shadow methods increased by 25% of the total damage, 20% chance to attack a charge Citation"
I heard this skill recharges your star. How does it work per TT? Or Avenger, if mobCount matters.

It places a giant shuriken on the ground for 60 seconds. Whenever you take damage, 1300% (not sure how this is calculated exactly) is reflected back onto whatever attacked you.