2010-07-18, 08:38 PM (This post was last modified: 2011-05-23, 10:10 AM by JoeTang.)
Flash Jump vs Teleport vs Soul Runner vs Recoil Shot vs Combat Step
Which is faster for covering flat horizontal distance with whatever buffs they want and in what order?
Was curious because I thought Recoil Shot was pretty fast and all before the Adventurer patch playing my Outlaw, but I just raced a friend and I beat him by quite a distance with Combat Step.
I'd like to think it's fairly obvious that Flash Jump is the fastest (OR IS IT?!), but what comes second, third, etc.
Spoiler
I just tested everything except Flash Jump since I don't have a character with it. All with no movement bonuses, done on the bottom of FM7 for flatness.
I started the measurement at the first movement, and ended when they hit the wall, either by walking into it or using their skill. Their use was as close to perfect as humanly possible. I used my regular method of "Combat Jumping" which is the fastest Combat Step can go. Teleport was just holding down the key + Walking. Soul Runner was a perfectly timed macro that used Jump+Soul Runner when the 1.5s delay ran out, walking forward the whole time. Recoil Shot was a Float+Recoil Macro, where Recoil was used as soon as possible after Floating, and Float was activated as soon as you hit the ground.
For Teleport, I estimated a bit; I took the amount of time to do 7 teleports, as there's some delay between reuse at the start, and scaled it to 8 teleports. It's something really weird with teleport. If you're actually traveling distance, it uses about 540ms, but if you're teleporting straight up with no platform above you, it goes at 600ms. It takes roughly 8 teleports to go across FM7, but with the minor walking distance, you can only use 7 teleports and you have to walk the final length. That's why Teleport was slightly slower before at 4.8s. Teleport Mastery doesn't make a significant difference and is immeasurable at these distances and with this method, but the estimation puts it at 3.8s as it is exactly 1.7/1.5x better than Teleport.
For Flash Jump, I had four methods. How everyone does it (which includes 140%speed/120%jump), is what I've seen the most. Jump. When you reach your peak, Flash Jump. Then I tried it while keeping my momentum because I started doing it out of habit, and it gets slightly better times. Correct me if I'm wrong that Night Lords don't already do this, but it seems really counter-productive for them, unlike a Shadower. Then I figured, hell, screw this time wasted traveling vertically, and Flash Jump the frame I left the ground, with, and without momentum. Haste in this case makes it slower because you gain vertical distance faster, which is what I don't want. The results with Haste in this case ended up about 0.1~0.2s slower but still faster than peak jumps.
If there's a faster way of doing any of these, let me know.
A thing to note is that Soul Runner and Recoil Shot both gain bonuses from Speed and Jump equips, which would affect these findings. More Jump gives a significant distance improvement to Jump + Soul Runner, and Speed obviously increases the speed at which you walk when it's under delay. Jump gives Recoil Shot + Float a higher peak to launch from, which should increase horizontal distance. Teleport's walking distance is so minimal though, I don't think much speed would affect it. Combat Step on the other hand, I've found Jump to be detrimental as it only keeps you in the air longer before your next Combat Step, causing you to just lose momentum instead. Speed I don't believe has any affect on it at all since there's no walking involved.
If I could get someone on Windia to Haste me, that'd be cool to test this out a bit more.
I'd say Flash Jump > Recoil Shot > Teleport > Soul Runner > Combat Step in terms of pure horizontal distance coverage, but I have never actually used Soul Runner.
Depends how you use Combat Step and Soul Runner. Soul Runner gets a lot more distance when you jump-cast it. Combat Step is pure horizontal momentum, but you have to time your jumps right to actually get anywhere fast. If you time it perfectly, I think it could possibly be the fastest.
Coming to mobility, I think that teleport is the best thing. Though flash jump is way faster, teleport is more handy.
For the others, I cannot comment by much as I've not really played those as much as I wish I could. However, recoil shot looks faster than soul runner, and soul runner is faster than combat step.
Devil's Sunrise Wrote:Coming to mobility, I think that teleport is the best thing. Though flash jump is way faster, teleport is more handy.
For the others, I cannot comment by much as I've not really played those as much as I wish I could. However, recoil shot looks faster than soul runner, and soul runner is faster than combat step.
I'd say flash jump is way handier. With the addition of jumping down, you can do all that teleport could. And also, you can use it on ledges, not only flat surfaces.
I've tried all except Flash Jump, Soul Runner and including Assaulter.
I'd say Recoil Shot is one of the best ones I've tried, along with Float. I also think that Assaulter is handy, if monsters are involved. It can be used in the air and you'll safely land on a platform.
Flash Jump covers massive ground. Recoil shot could compare to it, if the two skills had the same launching point. They don't. Thieves all have 120 or 123% jump. Pirates don't.
Recoil shot is just like Flash Jump, I think, except Pirates typically don't have 123% jump.
Teleport can't compete with any of the skills I've talked about so far in raw speed. At level 1 it's kind of close, but beyond that Flash Jump / Recoil Shot wins hands down.
Combat Step wins. Think I pomegranate you? Go use it in Nath or off a cliff. On a perfectly flat map though, it's worse than Teleport.
I'm not sure on Cygnus FJ Rips. I think they're shorter, but I've never used one when maxed.
Alloy Wrote:I'd say flash jump is way handier. With the addition of jumping down, you can do all that teleport could. And also, you can use it on ledges, not only flat surfaces.
It is possible to teleport up to a ledge from a flat surface and to a flat surface from a ledge.
Hazzy Wrote:Flash Jump covers massive ground. Recoil shot could compare to it, if the two skills had the same launching point. They don't. Thieves all have 120 or 123% jump. Pirates don't.
Some jump from shoes, 10 Jump from Quest Medal, 10 Jump from Dash, 5 Jump from MoN...I don't know why I wouldn't have 123 jump.
Hazzy Wrote:It's not hard to get, but is it standard?
I don't know if it's standard, but I'm just saying, I have like 133% Jump with Dash, easily hitting the cap, and it's not like I'm even trying to max my Jump. I'd assume most Corsairs have max or near max Jump.
Alloy Wrote:I'd say flash jump is way handier. With the addition of jumping down, you can do all that teleport could. And also, you can use it on ledges, not only flat surfaces.
Well, it depends on the map and the playing style, I suppose. Usually, I work(ed) with maps where I did [up][align=right]...[align=right][down][align=left]...[align=left][up]... and where a ladder was too far away to be practical. I could see people be faster with flash jump on those maps, but I always found teleport more relaxing and simpler to do.
Teleport is not the best for covering distance, but it's so useful for training. It allows mages to constantly attack while still changing position. Very useful.
Even when Flash jump is the fastest, others have their advantages.
Like Kabanaw said above, teleport is more versatile, you can attack while using it which makes it beyond great.
I must also say that combat step is awesome, it gives you a push that can be made a lot faster if you jump with the right timing, it might be even faster than teleport if timed correctly, also if there's a little abnormality in the floor it can push you much further.
Flash jump is the fastest when it comes to moving horizontally. Teleport is slower, but if it's a short distance it doesn't really matter, and teleport can be used vertically.
All of the others require some sort of gimmick (turning around mid air and firing behind you, pressing the skill and the jump key) and combat step is probably the worse just because it has the shortest range unless you're going off of a ledge, which is just inconvenient. Mastering a little trick to try and make combat step even to teleport is great and all, but I'd rather just press a button and achieve an effect that's better 99.99% of the time.
I just tested everything except Flash Jump since I don't have a character with it. All with no movement bonuses, done on the bottom of FM7 for flatness.
I started the measurement at the first movement, and ended when they hit the wall, either by walking into it or using their skill. Their use was as close to perfect as humanly possible. I used my regular method of "Combat Jumping" which is the fastest Combat Step can go. Teleport was just holding down the key + Walking. Soul Runner was a perfectly timed macro that used Jump+Soul Runner when the 1.5s delay ran out, walking forward the whole time. Recoil Shot was a Float+Recoil Macro, where Recoil was used as soon as possible after Floating, and Float was activated as soon as you hit the ground. If there's a faster way of doing any of these, let me know.
A thing to note is that Soul Runner and Recoil Shot both gain bonuses from Speed and Jump equips, which would affect these findings. More Jump gives a significant distance improvement to Jump + Soul Runner, and Speed obviously increases the speed at which you walk when it's under delay. Jump gives Recoil Shot + Float a higher peak to launch from, which should increase horizontal distance. Teleport's walking distance is so minimal though, I don't think much speed would affect it. Combat Step on the other hand, I've found Jump to be detrimental as it only keeps you in the air longer before your next Combat Step, causing you to just lose momentum instead. Speed I don't believe has any affect on it at all since there's no walking involved.
If I could get someone on Windia to Haste me, that'd be cool to test this out a bit more.
