[Post-Revamp] What would you do for a Bandit build?

No, your association is incorrect. Steal gets COMPLETELY outclassed by BoT. More damage, hits more targets. BoT hits more targets than BS, but BS does more damage and stuns.

That wasn't data, that was an anecdote about how mob skill does not translate to SUPAR FAST LEVELZ. And no, 43-80 is by far the easiest part of part of being a Bandit, or at least it has been for as long as MS has existed. Until Cygnus Knights and etc came out, Savage Blow was THE strongest attack in 2nd job. People often associate Assassins with being fast levellers even though they don't have any mob skills. It escapes me why they ignore Bandits. Range hasn't been an issue since they started flooding us with crowded maps like MP3 and Windraiders.

Also, Bombing Elder Wraiths is pretty much the fastest solo exp in 7x in the game right now, but of course that won't be an option once we get this patch.

Using steal during 2nd job is faster than using savage blow, even if only for CPQ. Disregarding a strong mob skill just because it becomes obsolete in the future is poor logic. As for training speeds, it's been long known that bandits are the slowest 2nd job trainers. But you don't have to agree with me, I've started more than my fair share of bandits just to quit them because savage blowing my way to 70 is ridiculous.

Also, I'd like to add that you're disregarding steal in favor of savage blow because it does more damage despite hitting fewer targets, but you won't disregard BoT and steal in favor of boomerang step even though it does more damage but hits fewer targets. In case that was too cryptic, your dogma is self-contradictory and you're hypocrites.

Using steal during 2nd job is faster than using savage blow, even if only for CPQ. Disregarding a strong mob skill just because it becomes obsolete in the future is poor logic. As for training speeds, it's been long known that bandits are the slowest 2nd job trainers. But you don't have to agree with me, I've started more than my fair share of bandits just to quit them because savage blowing my way to 70 is ridiculous.

Also, I'd like to add that you're disregarding steal in favor of savage blow because it does more damage despite hitting fewer targets, but you won't disregard BoT and steal in favor of boomerang step even though it does more damage but hits fewer targets. In case that was too cryptic, your dogma is self-contradictory and you're hypocrites.

It's not about targets and numbers, it's about what replaces what. Getting BStep does not mean you'll never use BoT again. Getting BoT (and maybe ME) means you'll never use Steal again. Bandits are not the slowest 2nd job trainers at all; their training speed isn't spectacular but it certainly doesn't suck. Hitting one target for 480% damage exceeds the total damage output of many other classes on mobs of 3-4 (I/L mages, Clerics, Gunslingers), and that's under the favorable assumption that you constantly have mobs to hit (which you don't, not even in CPQ once you're past level 43ish, and certainly not in your average training spot). Of course I'm using comparisons based on the game we're currently playing, but I think the point still stands. I would NOT leave a buff I'm going to be using forever at 110 seconds when I could max it at the cost of skipping a mob skill that will only help me for a short while.

Edit: Third job is a MUCH longer ride than second job. You have got to be kidding me about going through 2nd job with only 11 Steal being the same as going through 3rd job without BoT. You're forgetting the main reason we DON'T max Steal is so that we can max Booster. BoT can be maxed without skipping any important skills.

In steal's defense, it is actually usable for item hunting along with BS on mobs that take more than 2 hits.

Using steal during 2nd job is faster than using savage blow, even if only for CPQ. Disregarding a strong mob skill just because it becomes obsolete in the future is poor logic. As for training speeds, it's been long known that bandits are the slowest 2nd job trainers. But you don't have to agree with me, I've started more than my fair share of bandits just to quit them because savage blowing my way to 70 is ridiculous.

Also, I'd like to add that you're disregarding steal in favor of savage blow because it does more damage despite hitting fewer targets, but you won't disregard BoT and steal in favor of boomerang step even though it does more damage but hits fewer targets. In case that was too cryptic, your dogma is self-contradictory and you're hypocrites.

You clearly haven't trained right, then. CPQ is fast for a bandit with Savage Blow, and in GMS, a lot of people train on Gryphons 50-60. What does Steal do? Stun. What does stun do? Make flying monsters fall. Savage Blow wins out. Hoodoos/Voodoos only spawn in mobs of 4, and they're not in Steal range. Savage Blow wins out. Trying to mob Windraiders with a 220% mob skill is lol. Past that, it's BoT to 125.

EDIT : Bentuar, I'm not discounting Steal as completely useless, it's just not worth maxing when compared to other options.

Who the hell still trains on gryphons and h/voodoos?

I do. ._. Fine, more recent example. MP3. Spamming Steal takes longer to kill monsters when compared to Savage Blow since Savage Blow 2-3HKOs four monsters for a total of 8-12 hits, and Steal takes what, 20 uses? If another monster comes into the mob, have fun. A mob larger than 4 will pineapple up your pomegranate, that doesn't happen with Savage Blow.

Dude, large mobs only makes it easier for steal to f'uck SBs s'hit up. If steal kills 1 of those 4 original mobs before the other 3, it can hit that new mob. Besides, the monsters are stunned and steal has huge range. If anything, mobs larger than 4 f'uck up SB usage.

Dude, large mobs only makes it easier for steal to f'uck SBs s'hit up. If steal kills 1 of those 4 original mobs before the other 3, it can hit that new mob. Besides, the monsters are stunned and steal has huge range. If anything, mobs larger than 4 f'uck up SB usage.

Since when does Steal stun and actually have a decent range?

Since when does Steal stun and actually have a decent range?

250% range to one side vs 150% range on BoT for both sides, and the tables don't have any indication of steals stun being removed. 250% range is pretty good for 1) a bandit skill or 2) a 2nd job mob skill in general.

My brother kept getting annoyed at Steal's stun in CPQ, it prevent him from being able to gather mobs in Steal's range. : \

250% range to one side vs 150% range on BoT for both sides, and the tables don't have any indication of steals stun being removed. 250% range is pretty good for 1) a bandit skill or 2) a 2nd job mob skill in general.

Oh, I didn't even realize Steal stunned in GMS. It doesn't seem to stun in that one Shadower video we've seen so far. 250% range is terrible. I've played a Gunslinger (pre-buff).

Dude, large mobs only makes it easier for steal to f'uck SBs s'hit up. If steal kills 1 of those 4 original mobs before the other 3, it can hit that new mob. Besides, the monsters are stunned and steal has huge range. If anything, mobs larger than 4 f'uck up SB usage.

And what if it doesn't? 6 hits to one monster in one attack provides more damage stability than 1 hit to 1 monster per attack.

250% range is terrible. I've played a Gunslinger (pre-buff).

250% range is terrible for a gunslinger, but 250% range is excellent for a 2nd job bandit.

And what if it doesn't? 6 hits to one monster in one attack provides more damage stability than 1 hit to 1 monster per attack.

Who cares about stability when in large mobs? In that situation (a situation you will encounter literally all the time when training) the best thing is to just kill as fast as possible and you can't really argue that steal isn't the best thing available for that purpose. You can train fine with SB, but you can train way faster with steal.

No, your association is incorrect. Steal gets COMPLETELY outclassed by BoT. More damage, hits more targets. BoT hits more targets than BS, but BS does more damage and stuns.

Not true, you'll know when the mob behind you get venomed down to 1hp and you just used bstep to kill something in front and your bot can't finish the stuffs behind you because it can't reach...

Not true, you'll know when the mob behind you get venomed down to 1hp and you just used bstep to kill something in front and your bot can't finish the stuffs behind you because it can't reach...

Turn around a BoT it then.

Also, you guys are forgetting that this is post-revamp, meaning steal does 300% damage versus BoT's 395%.

250% range is terrible for a gunslinger, but 250% range is excellent for a 2nd job bandit.

Let's get back to the main issue here. Would you leave Booster at 11 just to max Steal? I'm speaking as someone who already owns 2 CBs and a level 50 Bandit, so I can ignore the fact that Steal even exists and go ahead and max a skill that's more useful in the long run. I accept that post-revamp Steal would make training faster than pure SB, but I still don't think it's worth it.

Let's get back to the main issue here. Would you leave Booster at 11 just to max Steal? I'm speaking as someone who already owns 2 CBs and a level 50 Bandit, so I can ignore the fact that Steal even exists and go ahead and max a skill that's more useful in the long run.

Having raised a 9x CB myself, yes, if i were raising a new bandit i would max steal. Obviously not if you're already a CB though.

If you have a pet that auto-casts skills in KMS you could even leave booster at level 2 and be fine. I wouldn't do that though just because it would increase cast lock up. :/

Turn around a BoT it then.

Have you even played a shadower? BoT range is about 1/3 of bstep range

Have you even played a shadower? BoT range is about 1/3 of bstep range

I have a level 145 Shadower, thank you very much. And if it's "that far" out of range I can assaulter back to it or ignore it and come back through later. Naming one specific instance where you MIGHT need steal is just silly, considering in the time it'd take me to turn around and use it BS's new cooldown would be over and I could just BS it! Or us assaulter!

I have a level 145 Shadower, thank you very much. And if it's "that far" out of range I can assaulter back to it or ignore it and come back through later. Naming one specific instance where you MIGHT need steal is just silly, considering in the time it'd take me to turn around and use it BS's new cooldown would be over and I could just BS it! Or us assaulter!

The original argument was to state that steal is not completely outclassed by BoT, and the sooner you finish a mob, the better your spawn is. BoT's efficiency is largely dependent on your positioning, it's best when you're in the middle of a mob. Assaultering behind you is just counter-productive. And by your logic there's no reason to use BoT at all in all cases if you can just spam bstep on everything