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Dual Blade Builds
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2010-05-26, 03:51 AM
Is Dual Blade darksight like Night Walker darksight? If so that would be nice, using other skills in darksight too. Maybe you can use all skills in darksight and hopefully you can pot in it :o
  
2010-05-26, 02:33 PM
You can't pot at all when in ADS at any levels. I've tested it at level 1 and 2 or 3 people from EF forums have tested it at max.
--- So for ADS we still need to find out if: Your pet can autopot you when you're in ADS Even then, I'm pretty sure I'm going to skip it entirely when I make a DB in global. It just seems like a hassle, it isn't a prereq for anything and all it does is gives a chance to stay in Dark Sight after performing an attack or buff. If it was like.. 80 or 90% I might max it, but that'd be 1.) ridiculously broken and 2.) suicide, so as it stands I'll probably go Disorder instead. Disorder is at least useful for anti-aggroing stuff. ..actually, does anyone know if Disorder works like Hypnotize at bosses? Like, at Bigfoot if you hypno it, it randomly runs into a wall and you lose aggro on it entirely. Disorder would actually be really useful if it does the same thing. 
2010-05-26, 05:05 PM
Mazz Wrote:You can't pot at all when in ADS at any levels. I've tested it at level 1 and 2 or 3 people from EF forums have tested it at max. Disorder makes the monster forget you attacked it, unless the monster is auto-aggressive, so yes.
Right, since Disorder does cancel the aggro on bosses, I'm going to skip ADS entirely and do a Dual Blade build like this:
Spoiler
Tweaked it a bit. This build should suit everyone, I intend to train at Windraiders till 75, Kentaurus till 92 and then either Himes or Galloperas until about 105. I might go to Typhons at 9x instead of Himes/Gallos but I hate falling off of the map. Owl Dead and Flash Bang are interchangeable depending on 1. your playing style, and 2. where you intend to train. Flash Bang would probably be most useful in luring monsters in large maps, or getting aggro on a monster that is a long way away. Owl Dead would be useful if you want a boost in power for a short time (particularly useful if you mob for a while and then have to clear the mob). Endure and Booster can be changed too, there is no speed difference in 17 or 20 booster, just the length of time that it lasts. Endure gives slightly more MP/HP recovery at 20 as opposed to 17. Entirely personal preference. 
2010-05-27, 08:37 PM
[COLOR="orange"]Well, while we're on the topic of useless skills, what about Owl Dead?
1.5x damage for 9 attacks? That'll be about 10-15 seconds. 60 second cooldown? 45-50 seconds of the effect being off. 390% damage and 40% probability for OHKO? That low damage isn't going to kill anything in a training area, so it's basically you only have the 40% chance to activate the effect, and as someone said before, that's pretty much never going to activate while taking out big bosses. Doesn't seem worth it to me.[/COLOR] 
2010-05-27, 10:44 PM
Mazz Wrote:Right, since Disorder does cancel the aggro on bosses, I'm going to skip ADS entirely and do a Dual Blade build like this: What's the point of maxing disorder though? The de-aggravation effect still works at level 3, and the defense-reducing doesn't work on bosses anyways. Neothisis Wrote:[COLOR="orange"]Well, while we're on the topic of useless skills, what about Owl Dead? I think the idea of owl dead is to use sudden raid after it, though I think that owl dead is still worth casting even before getting sudden raid for the 40% shot at a small boost of damage.
2010-05-27, 11:00 PM
Cyanne Wrote:What's the point of maxing disorder though? The de-aggravation effect still works at level 3, and the defense-reducing doesn't work on bosses anyways. [COLOR="orange"]Yeah, max Disorder isn't really going to get you anywhere...and the Defense thing probably does work on Bosses (post Balance at the very least), but 20 defense is not going to matter much to anyone. Nor will 20 attack. And Final Cut is better regardless no? I mean, sure, they probably stack, but it's still not that long of an effect, you'd be riding on FC's bonus more than Owl's.[/COLOR]
2010-05-28, 07:39 AM
Cyanne Wrote:What's the point of maxing disorder though? The de-aggravation effect still works at level 3, and the defense-reducing doesn't work on bosses anyways. There isn't anything else to max. I suppose you could replace it with endure, but how often do you wait around for HP to regen at a high level? 
2010-05-28, 07:40 AM
Mazz Wrote:There isn't anything else to max. I suppose you could replace it with endure, but how often do you wait around for HP to regen at a high level? Endure is for the MP recovery, which is always active, not when you're standing still.
2010-05-28, 09:48 AM
JoeTang Wrote:Endure is for the MP recovery, which is always active, not when you're standing still. Didn't know that. Confirmation that the time on Disorder is only a time limit for how long the weapon defence/attack (whatever) that is lowered lasts for? So if it has a time of 30 seconds the stats are lowered for 30 seconds, not the monster is un-aggro'd (not a word) for 30 seconds? If so, minimum Disorder and max Endure. Neither will /really/ make a difference in the long run, though. Edit: Flash Bang mechanics are the same as Grenade, yes/no?
2010-05-28, 09:56 AM
Mazz Wrote:Didn't know that. Confirmation that the time on Disorder is only a time limit for how long the weapon defence/attack (whatever) that is lowered lasts for? So if it has a time of 30 seconds the stats are lowered for 30 seconds, not the monster is un-aggro'd (not a word) for 30 seconds? From what I've seen, Flash Bang is thrown in an arc like Grenade, but it requires no charge time, so it should go about the same distance as a fully charged Grenade. The de-aggro from Disorder works until you re-aggro the monster. It's not a debuff where the monster cannot be aggro'ed for a set amount of time.
2010-05-28, 10:51 AM
JoeTang Wrote:From what I've seen, Flash Bang is thrown in an arc like Grenade, but it requires no charge time, so it should go about the same distance as a fully charged Grenade. The de-aggro from Disorder works until you re-aggro the monster. It's not a debuff where the monster cannot be aggro'ed for a set amount of time. Right, thanks. Going to update my build a few posts up now.
2010-05-28, 02:16 PM
Mazz Wrote:If so, minimum Disorder and max Endure. Neither will /really/ make a difference in the long run, though. [COLOR="orange"]Endure's MP recovery saves pots the rest of your Bandit/DB career once you get it. Also, it's quite useful in Dojo after a 1/1. And shouldn't Booster get maxed in 2nd+?[/COLOR]
2010-05-28, 03:05 PM
Neothisis Wrote:[COLOR="orange"]Endure's MP recovery saves pots the rest of your Bandit/DB career once you get it. Also, it's quite useful in Dojo after a 1/1. Rest of my build was this:
Spoiler
The rest is in the other post, trying to read over Cindy's build but I can't find which skills she did instead of the ones I did... I must be tired.
2010-05-30, 12:54 PM
I think I know the point of advanced dark sight now. Looking at this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5j0ZpoDn8w it seems to remove the delay from chains of hell. Apparently, the chains of hell delay makes it so you can't go into dark sight in that delay, so staying in dark sight skips this, letting you use chains immediately again. However, the first chain and the attack itself seem to be counted as separate attacks, so there's still only a 24.5% probability of this happening. This somewhat eliminates the problem of dying in dark sight because chains (both failed and successful) gives you such long invincibility that you could keep using chains even with near-death hp until it forces you to leave dark sight on its own. I think it's better to max it in this case, but the skill is still kind of a double-edged sword. Hopefully this can be figured out before people reach 4th job because it's passive and would need a ton of nx to reset.
2010-05-30, 02:09 PM
To be honest even if that is the case and the probability is so low for it to actually happen, I'd rather spend the SP on something else. There's still a /slight/ chance of death and you could just as easily use Fatal Blow after Chains when you're out of Dark Sight if there is a delay on it. I'm not sure if it'd work but a DS>Chains macro could be interesting. The difference in DPM wouldn't be too big if you just alternated DS+Chains > Fatal > DS+Chains > Fatal instead of trying to spam Chains anyway. I don't think it's worth spending 20 SP to find out and then have to spend loads of NX trying to reset it back out again.
2010-05-30, 02:17 PM
I guess i'll just save the SP, then. If people have no troubles, i'll max ADS.
2010-05-30, 05:05 PM
Mazz Wrote:To be honest even if that is the case and the probability is so low for it to actually happen, I'd rather spend the SP on something else. There's still a /slight/ chance of death and you could just as easily use Fatal Blow after Chains when you're out of Dark Sight if there is a delay on it. I'm not sure if it'd work but a DS>Chains macro could be interesting. The difference in DPM wouldn't be too big if you just alternated DS+Chains > Fatal > DS+Chains > Fatal instead of trying to spam Chains anyway. I don't think it's worth spending 20 SP to find out and then have to spend loads of NX trying to reset it back out again. Just going to play devil's advocate here, even if the damage difference between chains -> chains and chains -> fatal blow is small, you can't get that small boost in damage anywhere else, and chains of hell is better than fatal blow not only in damage but its massive invincibility and uninterrupted knockbacks on mobile bosses, similar to aran attacks. Also, the 20 SP isn't very important, it's basically 20 nimble body and 15 endure versus 15 nimble body and 20 advanced dark sight. It's easy not to die with it because chains of hell gives you almost a full second of invincibility after it finishes in addition to the invincibility it already has during the attack, so if you happen to stay in dark sight, you can use chains again, or if you leave dark sight, you have plenty of time to use a potion. There's an issue with SP resetting advanced dark sight because if you decide you don't want it anymore, it's impossible to reset it because there's nowhere for the SP to go, and if you didn't get it and want it later, you'll lose owl dead along with the nx you have to pay. Hopefully someone who plays kMS can tell us what kMSers think. |
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