To whoever said that Evans do suck at bosses.

No one is going to make those videos if you keep saying "nice try, but evans are the worst class in the game still". The point is, they can keep up. Period. If anything, that DPS would get better with future mastery skills. There are plenty of videos out there of higher level evans dishing out ~150k damage on bosses.

Who said Evans are the worst class in the game?

Evans may be able to "keep up" but that doesn't change the fact that Evan solo dps is worst then even us lolArchmages, no matter how high an Evan hits on a boss with a skill, most classes with comparable funding would be able to hit higher. It doesn't make Evan a bad class, and it certainly doesn't mean they can't boss and can't do well or better in certain bossing situations then other classes, but the fact is Evans have very low damage output.

Uh but thats the thing, who cares if he can kill it easier than you? like TakeBacker stated earlier nobody cares about stupid bosses such as this. Also like someone stated mages are strongest at first job, so because they kill king slime the best we should praise them as one of the best bossing classes? Get real, kill the bosses that matter. The higher end bosses, do them in a respectable amount of time then you can earn the title of a good bosser.

I thought being a good bosser is doing moderate/high damage and still provide party useful buffs. (how NLs provides haste which saves arse at times and shoot like pewpewpew and how BMs have sharp eyes and storm arrow)

Evans seems to be doing moderate damage and still provide good party skills. I still think evans are in the same rank as buccaneers at boss runs, not the same levels as mages, which is wwaaayy below.

I thought being a good bosser is doing moderate/high damage and still provide party useful buffs. (how NLs provides haste which saves arse at times and shoot like pewpewpew and how BMs have sharp eyes and storm arrow)

Evans seems to be doing moderate damage and still provide good party skills. I still think evans are in the same rank as buccaneers at boss runs, not the same levels as mages, which is wwaaayy below.

I guess we have different opinions on what a good bosser is. I don't see bishops as a good bossing class and they heal/dispell/bless/res/and even gen. I see a good bossing class as the ones who deal the damage. Bishop i see as an AMAZING supportive class, they make bossing easier and less stressful (and who doesn't love an extra 1.5% exp?). Sure that skill that reduces 20% of magic attks is nice but i wouldn't call them a good bosser because they have such supportive skills.. And the damage is just bleh....... at best.

Dealing good 1v1 damage is not the only aspect of bossing.

Dealing good 1v1 damage is not the only aspect of bossing.

You're right but it is the aspect that cuts boss times, saves money, and guarantee's maximum profit. Thus being the one that matters most.. Any class can boss, but we don't call every class in maplestory a good bossing class for a reason.

Because mob control and support skills that reduce time spent, helps save money, reduces deaths, and increase overall efficiency, dont exist. Also, just because you load up your boss run with tons of attackers doesn't guarantee maximum profit. Horntail doesn't look at your bossing squad and say, "Omg look at all those nightlords, I have to drop all those expensive skill books now !"

and Every class can boss well in certain situations, even Archmages. and yes, I am talking about damage output.

Because mob control and support skills that reduce time spent, helps save money, reduces deaths, and increase overall efficiency, dont exist. Also, just because you load up your boss run with tons of attackers doesn't guarantee maximum profit. Horntail doesn't look at your bossing squad and say, "Omg look at all those nightlords, I have to drop all those expensive skill books now !"

and Every class can boss well in certain situations, even Archmages. and yes, I am talking about damage output.

You definately have the wrong idea for what i meant by maximum profit.. To obtain maximum profit you must bring the least amount of runners that can get the job done.. bringing Evans to HT while they might be helpful and what not doesn't make them a "good bosser" only a good assister. Evans aren't good bossers and there's no fighting that >_>

Here's a video for you, Aslemn. Evans don't suck at all. Infact, they're not that bad as I can see, I've never tried Evan and never played.When I can get to GMS I Will make one :O
[video=youtube;vFzMt17SUmA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFzMt17SUmA[/video]

You realize the person skipped some parts in the video, so the run is not ~5 minutes long.

You definately have the wrong idea for what i meant by maximum profit.. To obtain maximum profit you must bring the least amount of runners that can get the job done.. bringing Evans to HT while they might be helpful and what not doesn't make them a "good bosser" only a good assister. Evans aren't good bossers and there's no fighting that >_>

Assisting victory in a boss run -

Bossing.

Also, Evans will have their own situations where they can deal great damage, every class does. Archmages at horntail and pink bean are a prime example.

They have low theoretical solo dps, sure, that doesn't mean they aren't good bossers.

Theres a reason why Corsairs aren't the only class that goes on boss runs, it takes multiple classes working together to insure the most efficent victory.

lolwut? archmages and horntail? and pb? they are not a primary source of dps/m.. just because they can do more damage in those areas than normal doesn't mean they "shine" because other classes easily outshine them. And the only magicians who go to HT or PB are bishops (at this point in time) so what on earth are you speaking of? Assisting victory in a boss run makes you a good bosser? does assisting goals/points in a sport make you a good finisher? Some people are best at assisting which is what magicians are, there is nothing wrong with that. But don't call them good bossers, they are good helpers to the run nothing more and nothing less.

Yes there is a reason Corsairs aren't the only classes that goes on boss runs.. But there is also a reason AM's don't get invited as well.

lolwut? archmages and horntail? and pb? they are not a primary source of dps/m.. just because they can do more damage in those areas than normal doesn't mean they "shine" because other classes easily outshine them. And the only magicians who go to HT or PB are bishops (at this point in time) so what on earth are you speaking of? Assisting victory in a boss run makes you a good bosser? does assisting goals/points in a sport make you a good finisher? Some people are best at assisting which is what magicians are, there is nothing wrong with that. But don't call them good bossers, they are good helpers to the run nothing more and nothing less.

Yes there is a reason Corsairs aren't the only classes that goes on boss runs.. But there is also a reason AM's don't get invited as well.

Ultimate spam on 5 monsters unbuffed > All attacker class damage output fully buffed.

F/p archmages fully buffed are on-par or even outdamage fully buffed nightlords at Pink Bean, thanks to pre-resistance. Slow is also a huge help for mobile bosses.

Assisting increases efficency, and helps win much easier, we clearly have very different views on what bossing characters are, as I believe 1v1 damage is not the only aspect of bossing, but whatever, opinions will be opinions.

lolwut? archmages and horntail? and pb? they are not a primary source of dps/m.. just because they can do more damage in those areas than normal doesn't mean they "shine" because other classes easily outshine them. And the only magicians who go to HT or PB are bishops (at this point in time) so what on earth are you speaking of? Assisting victory in a boss run makes you a good bosser? does assisting goals/points in a sport make you a good finisher? Some people are best at assisting which is what magicians are, there is nothing wrong with that. But don't call them good bossers, they are good helpers to the run nothing more and nothing less.

Yes there is a reason Corsairs aren't the only classes that goes on boss runs.. But there is also a reason AM's don't get invited as well.

Ouch, way to crash a party.

Ultimate spam on 5 monsters unbuffed > All attacker class damage output fully buffed.

F/p archmages fully buffed are on-par or even outdamage fully buffed nightlords at Pink Bean, thanks to pre-resistance. Slow is also a huge help for mobile bosses.

Assisting increases efficency, and helps win much easier, we clearly have very different views on what bossing characters are, as I believe 1v1 damage is not the only aspect of bossing, but whatever, opinions will be opinions.

not really they wont out dmg a NL fully buffed as well.. and PB still cuts down magic dmg in 50% btw

not really they wont out dmg a NL fully buffed as well.. and PB still cuts down magic dmg in 50% btw

PB doesn't reduce Poison and Lightning.

Even with PB's physical resistance, NLs and other physical attacking classes will outdamage Arch Mages. If Arch Mages outdamaged physical classes at PB, we would have killed it by now considering that Arch Mages don't have to be HP washed to survive.

Every class can boss, but some are better than others. 1v1 damage may not be the only important aspect of bossing, but those who don't deal exceptional 1v1 damage are brought for support/buffs. Arch Mages do neither of these. Slow isn't that useful at bosses considering that Warriors/Buccaneers can easily Rush/CSB bosses to keep them pinned.

Same goes for Evans. Their buffs aren't vital for most boss runs. Magical Resistance is their main selling point as a bosser, and that will only be useful at Pink Bean (and any stronger bosses we get in the future).

Even with PB's physical resistance, NLs and other physical attacking classes will outdamage Arch Mages. If Arch Mages outdamaged physical classes at PB, we would have killed it by now considering that Arch Mages don't have to be HP washed to survive.

Every class can boss, but some are better than others. 1v1 damage may not be the only important aspect of bossing, but those who don't deal exceptional 1v1 damage are brought for support/buffs. Arch Mages do neither of these. Slow isn't that useful at bosses considering that Warriors/Buccaneers can easily Rush/CSB bosses to keep them pinned.

Same goes for Evans. Their buffs aren't vital for most boss runs. Magical Resistance is their main selling point as a bosser, and that will only be useful at Pink Bean (and any stronger bosses we get in the future).

Including skill updates and apple, a Archmage will easily be on par with a nightlord, perhaps not outdamage him, although this is at bean himself, Archmages are still horrible 1v1ers at the statues which would be the reason why we can't go in there and own it up, but you are missing the point, there is situations at bossing where every class can do well, Horntail spam and at Pink Bean is places where Archmages can excel compared to other classes, and even with rush, slow makes things easier, especially if the warriors end up getting Kbed, seduce, or pwned.

In my opinion 1v1, as you said is not the only important aspect of bossing, and is not what determines what is and what is not a bossing character.

Including skill updates and apple, a Archmage will easily be on par with a nightlord, perhaps not outdamage him, although this is at bean himself, Archmages are still horrible 1v1ers at the statues which would be the reason why we can't go in there and own it up, but you are missing the point, there is situations at bossing where every class can do well, Horntail spam and at Pink Bean is places where Archmages can excel compared to other classes, and even with rush, slow makes things easier, especially if the warriors end up getting Kbed, seduce, or pwned.

In my opinion 1v1, as you said is not the only important aspect of bossing, and is not what determines what is and what is not a bossing character.

You're splitting hairs here. Archmage isn't a bossing class, it's a training class. A bishop is a support/training class. These things are obvious. An archmage barely if not is weaker than a dark knight unzerked. A fully buffed night lord does nearly 1/3 more than a dark in zerk. Unfortunatly I can't pull up the damage chart located on this site atm but you can see for yourself. If evan is weaker, or rather on par with an arch mage, doesn't say much about their DPS. A good bossing class is one that has staple support skills and has comparable damage. You can argue that because a character can do damage on a boss it is automatically a bossing character but thats a skewed view. And I won't ever turn down a friend who happens to be an arch mage for their DPS, but I won't lie, they are there because they are a friend of mine, not for their DPS. There is a reason, in speed runs, you see no mages at all. Unless it's of course an all mage run, obviously.

Ultimate spam on 5 monsters unbuffed > All attacker class damage output fully buffed.

Are you talking about on a boss? Because if not this statement is completely false.

Assisting increases efficency, and helps win much easier, we clearly have very different views on what bossing characters are, as I believe 1v1 damage is not the only aspect of bossing, but whatever, opinions will be opinions.

It is a damn major aspect. I would rather have 5 attackers and 1 support class in a party than 5 supporters and 1 attacker.

Don't get me wrong. I'm going to main my Evan.