4th job Single Target DPS

Max advanced combo should be 190% damage increase.



Hi. I was wondering how defense could affect the DPM for each class. I did some calculations myself with different hero swords. I got the result that different attack speed result in DPM that decreases with different speeds as defense increases. In other words a katana (2 speed with booster) for example could be better at 0 defense when comparing with a claymore (4 speed with booster). With the same stats, skills (max brandish and AC) a claymore could eventually, as the defense gets higher, become better in terms of DPM.

Katana range with apple 5681-10296. Claymore range with an apple 6568-12009. Im really interested seeing the actual DPM plots with varying monster weapon defense to prove/disprove this...

I understand that this actually does not reflect reality.

Doesn't Dusk's spreadsheet have an option for defense? (I didn't check the screenshot but I think it does.)

So with the skill rebalances underway, this thread obviously needs updating.

That's not what i'm posting for, though. As of right now, BoT is 250% damage to 6 mobs. SB is a little bit more than this, but also slightly slower. Question is, with the new B-step delay, would BoT -> B-step -> BoT out damage SB -> B-step -> SB?

250% is significantly lower than 480%. I doubt the speed difference will change much.

I say this knowing full well it won't be spammable. Apparently at the moment when you do BoT -> B-step -> BoT it doesn't work flawlessly, you have to wait a split second after using BoT to use B-step. The reduction will likely make the string flow smoothly.

Thus, i ask if it would out damage the SB/B-step string.

It's an impossibility.

I say this knowing full well it won't be spammable. Apparently at the moment when you do BoT -> B-step -> BoT it doesn't work flawlessly, you have to wait a split second after using BoT to use B-step. The reduction will likely make the string flow smoothly.

Thus, i ask if it would out damage the SB/B-step string.

B-step + SB is 1049.7% DPS
B-step + BoT is 969% DPS

May I request that this be uploaded to somewhere less stupid than Rapidshare? It's not letting me download at the moment.

Can someone make a table with the minimum damage output for each class. I'd like to see where MM rank in that list.


I know that if Strafe doesnt crit I can do as low as 15k with one Strafe...

Can someone make a table with the minimum damage output for each class. I'd like to see where MM rank in that list.


I know that if Strafe doesnt crit I can do as low as 15k with one Strafe...

ohhhh that could be a nice addition, would also help to show when X class can ohko a monster first or 2hko or however it goes for the leveling, and i just personally think corsairs would also liek this one >.> lol,

But theyre would have to be 2 collumns for it one with like... Lowest damage with no Crits and 1 with lowest damage with crits activating at their Set rate (iek in the normal one, that list might make NL's cry a little tho>.> think Rangers wuold like it a bit too(SE one anyways)

Can someone make a table with the minimum damage output for each class. I'd like to see where MM rank in that list.


I know that if Strafe doesnt crit I can do as low as 15k with one Strafe...

alex's calculator does this (he made a MM one for me) but its up to him to make it public or share you a copy

Can someone make a table with the minimum damage output for each class.

Just take off crits, replace the primary stat multipliers with minimums (what is it, 0.9*0.9*3.6 instead of 3.6 for Marksmen) and you get that. If min/max multipliers are the same you end up with a constant damage range and it'll show you your min instead of average hit.


Also, Strafe should crit 96% of the time so it's not like your minimum damage is very likely to happen. Especially tossing in the chance of being in the bottom bracket of your damage range.


At a guess, on mins I'd say AM<Bucc/Shadower<MM<NL<BM<Paladin<Hero<DK<Corsair, but the middle range (MN to Hero) are all gonna be pretty close.

And how many consecutive min damages would you want the Bowmaster to get? 1 second of non-crits? Half a second to match with Strafe's chance of 4 non-crits?

Just take off crits, replace the primary stat multipliers with minimums (what is it, 0.9*0.9*3.6 instead of 3.6 for Marksmen) and you get that. If min/max multipliers are the same you end up with a constant damage range and it'll show you your min instead of average hit.


Also, Strafe should crit 96% of the time so it's not like your minimum damage is very likely to happen. Especially tossing in the chance of being in the bottom bracket of your damage range.


At a guess, on mins I'd say AM<Bucc/Shadower<MM<NL<BM<Paladin<Hero<DK<Corsair, but the middle range (MN to Hero) are all gonna be pretty close.

And how many consecutive min damages would you want the Bowmaster to get? 1 second of non-crits? Half a second to match with Strafe's chance of 4 non-crits?

question, shouldnt classes that have critical have much lower min damage than non crit ones? is this min dmg per shot or if you do your min for x ammount of time?

Minimum dps (no crits, always hitting min damage), and the crits kinda balance out with the better min damage (90% mastery) and way better normal dps.


eg. Bowmaster 135,000 dps -> 51000 dps.
Shadower 70000 dps -> 49000 dps.

The BM loses a lot more but they're still ahead.

So uh, I quit MS, but I do want to update this for the new balance patches. Does anyone know how much the delays were reduced for Dark Sight/Dragon Strike? Also, I have no idea how dual charging works.

So uh, I quit MS, but I do want to update this for the new balance patches. Does anyone know how much the delays were reduced for Dark Sight/Dragon Strike? Also, I have no idea how dual charging works.

I know that the cooldown time for Dark Sight is 30 MS now.

To the best of my knowledge, dual charging:

Lightning (125%) + other charge base percents (110 to 150%) are multiplied.

Elemental advantage is cut to 25%, and only 1 advantage applies even if the monster is Lightning+x weak.

So the best neutral combination is 125%(lightning)*150%(holy), which also does higher dps than Lightning+Ice on Ice-weak stuff.

To the best of my knowledge, dual charging:

Lightning (125%) + other charge base percents (110 to 150%) are multiplied.

Elemental advantage is cut to 25%, and only 1 advantage applies even if the monster is Lightning+x weak.

So the best neutral combination is 125%(lightning)*150%(holy), which also does higher dps than Lightning+Ice on Ice-weak stuff.

Well that's for elemental damage...

We're still waiting for the first vid of a Paladin on NEUTRAL targets... for some reason those vids are not made / published / uploaded to youtube...

I was wondering... is kMS dieing or what? There used to be a shietload of kMS vids on youtube... now you have to scrape them all together and hope to see someting new there... strange...

Alternatively, elemental advantage is still full (there's no indication why it should be halved, unless everything else's element is halved too), and Holy + Lightning is somehow only 162.5% multiplier (i.e. Lit is halved and added, or is only multiplied by Holy's extra damage, or some other wizardry like that).

Just wondering, will you be adding in Evans since we have all their skill speeds?

Umm, looks like you guys have to redo your dps tables. For heroes, I think a lot of you think that with when you crit with se, it does 1.9*(260% + 140%) damage, that would mean 760% per brandish hit yea? My range is about 10,064 max range on my hero and my max is only 62k. I've tested it with rush with full 10 orbs and no orbs as well. I believe sharp eyes actually add on the % AFTER the modifier, not to the skill itself. Treat combo and brandish as one single attack %, then tag se 140% on it. So it's actually 1.9*260%+140% = 634%. I'm surprised no one ever noticed it and I took it for granted. The se for dark knights are still correct though, I think zerk is applied at the end before flooring it.

Now I regret making a hero, thanks a lot! SE just went from 8% boost to 4.25% for heroes lol. What a garbage skill.

Oh yeah, you might want to have someone check it with a paladin as well, it might be the same so se is like 2% boost for holy weak, not 4%. Check it for corsair too. Maybe homing applies as a multiplier before se as well.

Umm, looks like you guys have to redo your dps tables. For heroes, I think a lot of you think that with when you crit with se, it does 1.9*(260% + 140%) damage, that would mean 760% per brandish hit yea? My range is about 10,064 max range on my hero and my max is only 62k. I've tested it with rush with full 10 orbs and no orbs as well. I believe sharp eyes actually add on the % AFTER the modifier, not to the skill itself. Treat combo and brandish as one single attack %, then tag se 140% on it. So it's actually 1.9*260%+140% = 634%. I'm surprised no one ever noticed it and I took it for granted. The se for dark knights are still correct though, I think zerk is applied at the end before flooring it.

Now I regret making a hero, thanks a lot! SE just went from 8% boost to 4.25% for heroes lol. What a garbage skill.

Oh yeah, you might want to have someone check it with a paladin as well, it might be the same so se is like 2% boost for holy weak, not 4%. Check it for corsair too. Maybe homing applies as a multiplier before se as well.

All of the formulas used in the calculator are correct. Refer to Lucida's MS Formula Compilation.

Critical is applied before all damage multipliers except the base multiplier of the skill itself.

That's what I'm arguing about, the formula Lucida has is incorrect all along. I'm just pointing it out. My range was around 10,064 max and the highest I can hit with SE is 62.4k. If the formula is correct, I should be hitting 1.9*(240%+160%) = 760% -> 76k, which I'm not, instead I'm hitting 1.9*240%+160% -> 632% -> 62.4k. I'm not sure if you're into researching damage formula, I'll just repost it in Lucida's thread.

Let me just say I'm sure critical isn't working what everyone thinks. I have a dark knight and a hero myself and I can tell the difference. By logic, hero with SE should hit a lot more, yet DK is the one that hits higher max buster with SE. Even balancing attack and ratio, the difference to much to make sense.

That's what I'm arguing about, the formula Lucida has is incorrect all along. I'm just pointing it out. My range was around 10,064 max and the highest I can hit with SE is 62.4k. If the formula is correct, I should be hitting 1.9*(240%+160%) = 760% -> 76k, which I'm not, instead I'm hitting 1.9*240%+160% -> 632% -> 62.4k. I'm not sure if you're into researching damage formula, I'll just repost it in Lucida's thread.

Let me just say I'm sure critical isn't working what everyone thinks. I have a dark knight and a hero myself and I can tell the difference. By logic, hero with SE should hit a lot more, yet DK is the one that hits higher max buster with SE. Even balancing attack and ratio, the difference to much to make sense.

The reason I'm unwilling to take any of your findings seriously is because the research on these formulas was done years ago and the subject of the accuracy of them has been beaten to death many times. I don't see the error you're making right now, but it probably has to do with either a misreported damage range or however you're applying SE.

And no, DrKs have always gotten a bigger damage boost than Heroes from SE, simply due to the fact that the base % damage on Crusher is lower than the base % damage on Brandish. DrKs have a much easier time outdamaging Heroes with SE than without.