Bossing Ability Chart

So I was thinking of making a chart that would compare how well different classes do at different bosses. It would just be a table with a simple color code:

Blue (or maybe Green with a Star) = best or one of the best class at X (ex. Heros/Pallys at BF)
Green = fully competent, useful class at X (ex. most classes at Zakum)
Yellow = mediocre class at X (ex. Corsairs at BF)
Red = class cannot attempt X without some fulfilling some extreme, extraneous condition / class is pretty much useless (ex. warriors at Grandpa Boss)

Bossing is an important endgame activity, so on other forums ask what class they should make for bossing ALL THE TIME, and they rarely specify what exactly they want to do. I was thinking an easy to read color chart would be very helpful. I didn't want to get started on such a thing if it doesn't sound helpful/sounds like it would just cause arguments, though.

I could also put a section on the bottom for how well different party buffs stack up in different party setups.

And as for equilavent funding you should make it so that everyone of that class has perfect stat gear. Then no one would argue about 'unfair funding comparisons'. Make it the most extreme on amount of damage. Everytime i use your chart I always get told the table's data isn't a fair comparison

This will definitely cause some arguments

But let us see the chart

I think you need a step between yellow and red for possible but do not attempt. Like Ergoth is all-resistant, sure you can kill him on an elemental class but it won't be anywhere near the speed other classes do it.

Or downgrade yellow based on percent of damage/time taken.
100% = blue
80%+ of best class = green
40%+ of best class = yellow
less = orange
0% (unable to damage) = red

The trouble is giving the ratings context. At level 180 skills are available, hp is higher and KB is easier. Some classes come out of 4th job more quickly than others, or are better suited at lower levels.


Maybe split it into a colour and letter rating, colour:damage%, letter:class vs. class combined ratings. Range/Melee, usefulness of HP/Avoid, etc. combined to feasibility of killing the boss. With A being "easy" (stand in 1 spot and hold your primary attack, you will always hit), B being "using pots" (stand in 1 spot and attack, use a pot when your hp gets below some amount), C being "chase the boss"/"heavy pots"/"strategic" (you can't easily pin the boss, he will flee you and you can't hit him a lot of the time, or he costs a disproportionate amount of pots for the rewards, or naive players will die (seduce/damage reflect fit in there if they're manageable)), D being "annoying as hell" (the CKPQ archer vs. corsair/mage/bowman comes to mind), F being "do not attempt, you can do the damage but you will never kill this boss". Anego's 18k melee damage comes to mind... sure, it's a holy-weak boss and my Paladin would be high on dps-charts, but uh... 1 slap and I die no matter what.


ex HH is an A for ranged classes, B to C for melee (depends if the pumpkin is useful to you, as his other drops are worth an average of maybe 1500 mesos). Zakum is A for pretty much everyone (B for magicians if they use MG). Papulatus is B.

And as for equilavent funding you should make it so that everyone of that class has perfect stat gear. Then no one would argue about 'unfair funding comparisons'. Make it the most extreme on amount of damage. Everytime i use your chart I always get told the table's data isn't a fair comparison

It's just based on ability. A ranged class is going to suck at Rellik no matter how good their funds are.

And as for equilavent funding you should make it so that everyone of that class has perfect stat gear. Then no one would argue about 'unfair funding comparisons'. Make it the most extreme on amount of damage. Everytime i use your chart I always get told the table's data isn't a fair comparison

[color="#cc8899"]
That's already taken care of in the DPS calculators. This will include (I assume) desired buffs, ability to take hits, ability to kb, etc. Several factors, not straight DPS.

May want to include "Can reasonably use Berserk" as a column, and give anything with 8k or less damage a tick.[/COLOR]

[color="#cc8899"]
That's already taken care of in the DPS calculators. This will include (I assume) desired buffs, ability to take hits, ability to kb, etc. Several factors, not straight DPS.

May want to include "Can reasonably use Berserk" as a column, and give anything with 8k or less damage a tick.[/COLOR]

Did you read my post because it started with and. Whenever I use that chart as a reference for DPS comparison's I get ridiculed that the equipment isn't fairly compared . Hence why I mentioned it.

Did you read my post because it started with and. Whenever I use that chart as a reference for DPS comparison's I get ridiculed that the equipment isn't fairly compared . Hence why I mentioned it.

Justed wanted to emphasize that he's already done that part of the work elsewhere. It seems fairly obvious to implement the results here.

Any boss except for BF and Rellik: Nightlord (/Walker) with SE + Onyx apple will come out best...

Reasons:
- 65% Critical rate with SE -> best of all classes in-game
- Fastest spam attack in-game (Triple Throw + SP) (read: none is faster, except for weaker hits)
- Has lowest base weapon attack in-game -> Onyx apple is most effective fior NL/NW
- Alchemist + Onyx apple = Best onyx apple user in-game
- Dark Sight = Best ability to avoid high touch damage in-game
- At PB, you NEED the NL+SE+Onyx Combination, because other classes don't do enough DPM to kill it under 1 hour, bye bye gametactics here, all you need is a washed NL+SE+Onyx...

Sad but true... Maplestory is teameffort/teamplay is a 1-dimensional way... there is only 1 winner, always... No matter how hard you try, Nexon just fails4life at -ANY- form of class balancing regarding to bosses, especially Nexon America... :')

I notice this so hard on my Nightwalker... My Shadower is lvl 150, but even when I would get him to lvl 200, my NW+SE+Onyx will outdamage him and I'm using the same equips for both... so fcking annoying in a way... though in a way... I'm glad I have a DPM wh()re class now...

Probably shouldn't feed the troll but here goes.

Reasons:
- 65% Critical rate with SE -> best of all classes in-game

Buccs = 75% crit.
Arans = Higher and stronger than that.

- Alchemist + Onyx apple = Best onyx apple user in-game

Doesn't mean s'hit for damage

- Dark Sight = Best ability to avoid high touch damage in-game

Except on auto aggro mobs.

- At PB, you NEED the NL+SE+Onyx Combination, because other classes don't do enough DPM to kill it under 1 hour, bye bye gametactics here, all you need is a washed NL+SE+Onyx...

Read: I can never notice that the only reason NLs are used is because they save money with alchemist and that PB is a s'hitty boss in the first place.

especially Nexon America... :')

Except for when they do something awesome for you. You just go right back to bashing them when they f'uck up again. Idiot.

Probably shouldn't feed the troll but here goes.



Buccs = 75% crit.
Arans = Higher and stronger than that.



Doesn't mean s'hit for damage



Except on auto aggro mobs.



Read: I can never notice that the only reason NLs are used is because they save money with alchemist and that PB is a s'hitty boss in the first place.



Except for when they do something awesome for you. You just go right back to bashing them when they f'uck up again. Idiot.

1) Probably only thing he was wrong about

2) 2 extra minutes of 100 weapon attack>2 less minutes of 100 weapon attack

3) You DS bigfoot doesn't touch you. Depends on the monster/boss.

4) NL's are used because they currently have the 2nd best DPS in the game and speed up a boss run with less pots more than any other class.

5) Get off your high horse, you'll suffocate outside of our atmosphere.

1) Probably only thing he was wrong about

2) 2 extra minutes of 100 weapon attack>2 less minutes of 100 weapon attack

3) You DS bigfoot doesn't touch you. Depends on the monster/boss.

4) NL's are used because they currently have the 2nd best DPS in the game and speed up a boss run with less pots more than any other class.

5) Get off your high horse, you'll suffocate outside of our atmosphere.

2) It's 5 minutes, and that doesn't increase attack. It saves money. In the case of everyone having the same amount of apples then yes it raises attack.

3) Yeah, and you won't be DSing at PB. (if you're going to rebut by quoting my following points, i'll rebut before you and say that PB was the example given) Nor will you DS when fighting any boss in the game except BF to avoid TOUCH damage when you're a RANGED class.

4) And to say that NLs are the only class you need at PB because their damage is "pro" is retarded. Bringing up PB in the first place is retarded because it's still a s'hitty boss.

5a) You must be new here if you don't agree after reading devil's posts.

5b) I could say the same for you.

- At PB, you NEED the NL+SE+Onyx Combination, because other classes don't do enough DPM to kill it under 1 hour, bye bye gametactics here, all you need is a washed NL+SE+Onyx...

With P resist and all that, you sure Mages wouldn't out-DPS NLs?

2) It's 5 minutes, and that doesn't increase attack. It saves money. In the case of everyone having the same amount of apples then yes it raises attack.

3) Yeah, and you won't be DSing at PB. (if you're going to rebut by quoting my following points, i'll rebut before you and say that PB was the example given) Nor will you DS when fighting any boss in the game except BF to avoid TOUCH damage when you're a RANGED class.

4) And to say that NLs are the only class you need at PB because their damage is "pro" is retarded. Bringing up PB in the first place is retarded because it's still a s'hitty boss.

5a) You must be new here if you don't agree after reading devil's posts.

5b) I could say the same for you.

1) You said it doesn't make a difference in Damage, relevant to the overall DPS, in this case DPM. Once again having 5 extra minutes of 100 weapon attack or whatever weapon attack>any other class. Therefore makes NL's best apple users and he was correct about.

3) He said to avoid touch damage. PB was a seperate example for a seperate point. His PB example clearly was implying that NL's are there for the pure DPS.

4) From my understanding every class is needed for PB, NL's being an attacking portion of the parties constructed, yes?

5) I'm not being biased, you're downright flaming him, kind of like majority of your responses to most players.

You can't say the same about me because I'm correcting you without demeaning myself to personal attacks. I gave you a suggestion so your opinion would have some respect behind it. Take it or leave it.

Jesus Christ, if you can't stop arguing you should ignore each other. This thread is not up for debate, it's objective comparison.

Would you count ranged classes having to hp wash for PB as an unreasonable boss?

With P resist and all that, you sure Mages wouldn't out-DPS NLs?

Maybe, but I think even with halve their damage, NL's with SE + Onyx will come close if not still above Mage's max damage.... Don't forget the Cygnus Blessing watt boost, that one is again in the favour of NL's/NW's... if only watt/matt boost potion's were percentage wise...

Idiot.

Yes.... right.... sure.... very mature....

Anyway, to get back on-topic, maybe it's a better idea to reverse the thing we're looking for, not "what class is best at what boss", but to ask the question, "what boss is best for every specific class".

This to avoid the Maplestory trapdoor that the outcome is always a one-way-ticket to the same station...

Anyway, to get back on-topic, maybe it's a better idea to reverse the thing we're looking for, not "what class is best at what boss", but to ask the question, what "boss is best for every specific class".

The way I understand it, this would be both - all classes and all bosses would be rated, so if you want to see which boss is best for a class you just look at that row instead of the column.

1) You said it doesn't make a difference in Damage, relevant to the overall DPS, in this case DPM. Once again having 5 extra minutes of 100 weapon attack or whatever weapon attack>any other class. Therefore makes NL's best apple users and he was correct about.

3) He said to avoid touch damage. PB was a seperate example for a seperate point. His PB example clearly was implying that NL's are there for the pure DPS.

4) From my understanding every class is needed for PB, NL's being an attacking portion of the parties constructed, yes?

5) I'm not being biased, you're downright flaming him, kind of like majority of your responses to most players.

You can't say the same about me because I'm correcting you without demeaning myself to personal attacks. I gave you a suggestion so your opinion would have some respect behind it. Take it or leave it.

1) I wonder if i should be using the PB example for this again but i don't see why it matters anymore.

In that case, there's a 1 hour timer currently. 60 minutes = 4 apples for a NL, and 6 for any other class that would bother using them (which is pretty much every single class since all PB runs are super srs runs). Does the NL in this case get more attacking power? No. They just save 2 apples worth of mesos, which is what? Like 6mish? (I don't keep up with apple prices because i don't use them)

For zak, if a high level NL is running, everyone pretty much just gives apples to them if they have em i guess. Zak isn't a serious boss so serious comparisons aren't necessary. (Every run i go on ends in half an hour at max without use of apples, and spending millions to half the speed of the run isn't worth it)

3) If you want to go back to the pure concept of dodging hits, devil already argued way back when that buccs are the best at that. Invincibility frames for avoiding damage > dark sight. Spamming CSB gets you the same exact result as what DS gives. For traveling purposes, there is no difference between the two.

4) Not purely NLs. Corsairs and archers too. Warriors for rushing/tanking. Mages for mob control. Every class has a purpose. By saying that you NEED a NL PURELY for their damage and nothing else, he is 1) assuming that we'll keep the 1hr time limit, which was made longer in other versions already, and 2) completely disregarding the fact that saving money is another priority that runners have to consider. If you don't save money, then you're probably wasting a ton more than you'll gain by killing him in the first place.

 Drama onoes

5) There are only a few users i would actually consider myself to flame. (flaming in your case being condescending tones, which still isn't actually flaming) Limiting this to users on SP (because a list of people on basil/SW would get unnecessarily long): You, and devil. Devil i almost never flame in the first place because he never posts, but when he does he always bashes nexon america out of f'ucking no where. Like i said before, if nexon releases a patch that benefits him, he kisses their ass. If not/if they screw up even if the screw up has nothing to do with him, he'll bash. Pathetic, no?

You think i flame most people because you dislike me, as i you. I never flame anyone otherwise. Feel free to dig up a post contradicting that if you want.

 Spoiler

without demeaning myself to personal attacks

5) Get off your high horse, you'll suffocate outside of our atmosphere.

I feel personally attacked.

Yes.... right.... sure.... very mature....

I see what you did there.

I'm surprised for NLs, no one mentioned Fake/Avoid. That helps at certain bosses so their attacks aren't interrupted.

And like Dusk said, this is based on abilitiy more. Stuff like warriors Stance, Corsair's bullseye, passive skills, etc

1) I wonder if i should be using the PB example for this again but i don't see why it matters anymore.

You are beating this pb crap to the ground. He used it as an example that the NL's attack is needed at pink bean to take it down. That's it.

In that case, there's a 1 hour timer currently. 60 minutes = 4 apples for a NL, and 6 for any other class that would bother using them (which is pretty much every single class since all PB runs are super srs runs). Does the NL in this case get more attacking power? No. They just save 2 apples worth of mesos, which is what? Like 6mish? (I don't keep up with apple prices because i don't use them)

For zak, if a high level NL is running, everyone pretty much just gives apples to them if they have em i guess. Zak isn't a serious boss so serious comparisons aren't necessary. (Every run i go on ends in half an hour at max without use of apples, and spending millions to half the speed of the run isn't worth it)

I personally host my own runs and give out about 12 apples to my 6 man squads, 2 each, (2 extra if someone happens to dc/lag out). See how I can pick precise scenario's to hold up my argument? Devil's statement simply said that NL's get the most out of apples out of every class. I think an extra 5 minutes would constitute that, considering thats 5 extra minutes of double your damage.

3) If you want to go back to the pure concept of dodging hits, devil already argued way back when that buccs are the best at that. Invincibility frames for avoiding damage > dark sight. Spamming CSB gets you the same exact result as what DS gives. For traveling purposes, there is no difference between the two.

Pure concept? No he said DS to avoid touch damage, I never recalled him saying PB or HT or such. Just in general, true statement I might add. Depending on the monster aggroed also makes your statement a possibility. The point is you went to a max extreme going to a boss like that.

PURELY[/b] for their damage and nothing else, he is 1) assuming that we'll keep the 1hr time limit, which was made longer in other versions already, and 2) completely disregarding the fact that saving money is another priority that runners have to consider. If you don't save money, then you're probably wasting a ton more than you'll gain by killing him in the first place.

Did I say just Nls? No. I said that they are needed for PB for their damage, end of story.

5) There are only a few users i would actually consider myself to flame. (flaming in your case being condescending tones, which still isn't actually flaming) Limiting this to users on SP (because a list of people on basil/SW would get unnecessarily long): You, and devil. Devil i almost never flame in the first place because he never posts, but when he does he always bashes nexon america out of f'ucking no where. Like i said before, if nexon releases a patch that benefits him, he kisses their ass. If not/if they screw up even if the screw up has nothing to do with him, he'll bash. Pathetic, no?

You think i flame most people because you dislike me, as i you. I never flame anyone otherwise. Feel free to dig up a post contradicting that if you want.

 Spoiler

I feel personally attacked.

[/spoiler]

As too your spoiler, calling people idiots and taking a condecending tone is offensive, and according to Magnus, isn't something most moderators tolerate. And yes, calling people idiots and ignorant is pretty contradicting to your entire post.


To your second spoiler I suggested you dropped the attitude. I used a common phrase to get it across to you. Sorry if you don't like me being blunt to you but if you hadn't in the first place maybe this wouldn't be an appropriate time now would it?


Done yet?

Oh and I have no personal quarms with you, but I will defend someone being outright attacked.