Knight of Cygnus: Soul Master

@Electric, it's quite a bit. Nothing really exact but a lot for lower lvls, especially for CPQ type things. It will ultimately get you more points and allow you to kill faster. And yes, that's the build hes suggesting, though, you should really get max Soul Blade in the beginning instead of getting 21 then waiting.

You can't just assume that you should go the Mastery build because "that's the conventional wisdom for warriors" This isn't a warrior. It's a Soul Master. Soul Master =/= Warrior. Though they have similar skills, they aren't the same. It would be like assuming the build for a Paladin is the same as one for a Hero.

Soul Blade, no matter what, should come before Mastery. Soul Runner, can be either 2nd or 1st. You need that extra mobility during training, it's going to be a key aspect of it.

For CPQ, I'm thinking Slash Blast is still going to be good enough to last you until you get Mastery maxed and then start into Soul Blade. I'm not saying Soul Blade isn't an improvement, but is it going to level me a ton faster than Mastery and Slash Blast would through those levels? I'd just like to hear some specific examples of where it's better, and how much better it is. Something like, with slashblast you'd usually get x amount of CP, with Soul Blade first you'd get x amount of CP instead. Or with slashblast you'd be killing x monsters in x number of hits and with Soul Blade you'd be killing x monsters in x number of hits instead. Or with Soul Blade you can train at x places whereas with slash blast you can only train at x places. And if no one feels like doing it, then I'll just wait until Soul Master comes out and do both builds myself to find out the answer. XP

Conventional wisdom has more to do with what average people will do than what you or I would do individually. Most people, if they were suddenly able to make a Soul Master, would indeed max Mastery first. Some people might put points into Soul Runner first, or even into Soul Blade, but for most people, they'd still work on maxing mastery as soon as possible. It's called conventional wisdom because most people would consider it the wisest choice. It may prove not to be the wisest choice, but it takes time and evidence to show that. We've got plenty of time to disprove or prove my thoughts on it, but very little evidence. So far all I've gotten is your and Kirov's words, which while they're better than my inexperienced thoughts on Soul Masters, they're not quite enough for me to go with what your conventional wisdom states.

Soul Runner remains an unknown for me at the moment, mostly because I like the idea of better movement, but I'm still not sure how soon I really need it versus how soon I really want it. I may want it sooner than I need it, or need it sooner than I want it. I suppose alot of it will depend on whether I decide to go Soul Blade first as you and Kirov suggest.

Until Soul Blade is level 21+, I wouldn't completely count out Slash Blast and Power Strike. They still have their uses in certain situations, namely Carnival PQ. In CPQ, I usually used Soul Blade to gather mobs, then Slash Blast them away. If there was one or two left, I'd cut them down with Power Strike. Power Strike is also good for boss monsters. You wouldn't be using Soul Blade over Power Strike on a single target. That's just plain dumb. That's like using Iron Arrow instead of Double Arrow on a boss. There's no point to it, since you can kill it much easier and much faster with the single target skill.

finally, a real post, instead of something telling me not maxing powerstrike is dumb. which it says anyways, but at least you give reasons.

i dont feel like bossing is a valid reason though. you might be at zak once you get brandish, same for pap and pianus. but area bosses except for hh (which has high enough avoid that you probably wont go for it before you have brandish) dont have the stamina for you to care about dps. with soul blade as a ranged skill and without powerguard you might as well just stay out of attack range to kill them.

i never discounted slash blast. i question whether powerstrike is useful if you use it for about 10 levels. such a short lifespan doesnt make me want to get it. i agree that the utility of other skills is marginal, but every video of KoC chars has an accompanying sprite summoned. iron body can be macroed to rage so you dont even need to assign it a button, or use it if you dont want to waste the split second it takes to cast.

as yall say, soul master != warrior. why get powerstrike if you barely use it and it gets replaced by the time you are useful at any bosses?

About this whole maxing vs. not maxing power strike issue I would have to go with definately maxing it. You want good single damage per second, too. To be honest the sprite is pretty much worthless. Its damage doesn't really change as you level. The difference between maxed powerstrike and not maxing powerstrike is a lot greater compared to the sprite. Whenever I play my SM I usually don't even turn on the sprite at all. It doesn't help me kill at all. Even in 3X the damage is too little to even be helpful.

Anyways for second job I propose this skill build:

 Spoiler

Level 30: 1 Soul Blade (1)
Level 31: +3 Soul Runner (3)
Level 32: +3 Soul Runner (6)
Level 33: +3 Soul Runner (9)
Level 34: +1 Soul Runner (Maxed at 10), +2 Mastery (2)
Level 35: +3 Mastery (5)
Level 36: +3 Booster (3)
Level 37: +3 Booster (6)
Level 38: +3 Soul Blade (4)
Level 39: +3 Soul Blade (7)
Level 40: +3 Soul Blade (10)
Level 41: +3 Soul Blade (13)
Level 42: +3 Soul Blade (16)
Level 43: +3 Soul Blade (19)
Level 44: +2 Soul Blade (leave it at 21 for now[Hits 5]), +1 Mastery (6)
Level 45: +3 Mastery (9)
Level 46: +3 Mastery (12)
Level 47: +3 Mastery (15)
Level 48: +3 Mastery (18)
Level 49: +1 Mastery (level 19 for 60% mastery), +2 Final Attack (2)
Level 50: +3 Soul Blade (24)
Level 51: +3 Soul Blade (27)
Level 52: +3 Soul Blade (Maxed at 30)
Level 53: +3 Final Attack (5)
Level 54: +3 Rage (3)
Level 55: +3 Rage (6)
Level 56: +3 Rage (9)
Level 57: +3 Rage (12)
Level 58: +3 Rage (15)
Level 59: +3 Rage (18)
Level 60: +1 Rage (19 for +10 weapon attack) +2 Final Attack (8)
Level 61: +3 Final Attack (11)
Level 62: +3 Final Attack (14)
Level 63: +3 Final Attack (17)
Level 64: +3 Final Attack (20)
Level 65: +3 Final Attack (23)
Level 66: +3 Final Attack (26)
Level 67: +3 Final Attack (29)
Level 68: +1 Final Attack (Maxed at 30) +1 Booster (7)
Level 69: +3 Booster (10)
Level 70: +1 Rage (Maxed at 20), +1 Booster(Caped at 11) +1 Mastery(Maxed at 20)

Soul Runner: Maxed (10)
Soul Blade: Maxed (30)
Mastery: Maxed (20)
Final Attack: Maxed (30)
Booster: (11)
Rage: Maxed (20)

Why? Essentially booster is as good at level 11 then it is at level 20. It isn't like infgihters who need level 20 booster for a critical 4th job skill. I often find myself overbuffing so 11 booster should be good enough.

Well as for what build I did, I couldn’t really recommend it since I made it up as I went along. I got 1 soul runner at 31 just to test it out but since it was terrible at that level I decided to max it. I did something like

30 1 soul blade
31 1 soul blade 1 mastery 1 soul runner

then I maxed soul runner and pretty much followed the pattern of 2 mastery 1 soul blade until I got a fair amount of mastery then pumped my points into soul blade. I also got booster quite late.


What I would do on flat maps is use soul blade then soul runner and repeat that till I had rounded all the monsters into the corner then I finished them off with slash blast, until I got soul blade to a fair level. Then slash blast became totally obsolete.

Also, I'm curious as to which maps did you use that are "ineffective" with regular 2nd job warriors?

Well a great map for me to level on was Retz. Pretty much just do it the same way an I/L would. You can stand on the screws and attack the Retz without getting hit and having to move much, only when you have to drop down below to keep the spawn going. Levelling there was a breeze and really fast.

I’ll take some Screen shots to show what I mean and edit them in later.

Edit -

 Spoiler

As you can see you can stand on the bottom screw and hit the Retz on the bottom as well as on the first platform. Avoiding any damage. Very similar to what an I/L would do but you have a much greater range.

 Spoiler

It's true that the summon doesn't do all that great damage. But it's a first job skill so what can you expect? I do find it can be really useful at luring in monsters for mobbing with Soul Blade. You can see it attacked the Retz behind me which then lures it over into soul blades range.

 Spoiler

Then you can clear the other 2 platforms by jumping up a couple of screws. You can also see in the first SS that soul blade hits monsters directly below you too.

 Spoiler

It can also change the way you would normally train on some maps too. There are two sniping platforms in the Iron Mutae’s map. They are pretty much useless for a normal warrior but you can take advantage of them as a soul master. Like I said soul blade hits monsters right below you. So you can simply snipe them from the 2 safe spots. You can use soul runner to jump the gap between the two spots so again it’s possible to take no damage. The picture in the middle also shows just how good a range soul blade has.

I wasn’t trying to be overly critical when you suggested the mastery slash blast route. It would be sufficient since that’s what every other warrior does. But I think soul masters have much more potential and possibilities than normal warriors. Having soul blade opens up much greater training possibilities.

and i am curious as to how best use that potential. so when you tell me you replace skills you just maxed with soul blade, i have to wonder why you maxed them in the first place.

Random bit of information, I have a 2nd job warrior without PS (well, it has level 4 - in GMS this is 130%, same as SB, but costs 4mp) and it has no problem with winning CPQ vs similar level chars.

In any situation where you hit 2 monsters, PS is pointless. If you're not hitting mobs in CPQ, Bandit/Assassin beat you anyway since they have higher dps (but no mob skills). Just party with someone to take out teh single monsters.

If the 25 def/mdef the summon gives stack with Iron Body I'd say get those 2. Otherwise just go with max summon + 11 PS.

I wasn’t trying to be overly critical when you suggested the mastery slash blast route. It would be sufficient since that’s what every other warrior does. But I think soul masters have much more potential and possibilities than normal warriors. Having soul blade opens up much greater training possibilities.

I don't think you were being overly critical Kirov, and I'm all for maxing Soul Blade early based upon the information so far. I just have trouble believing it's better to do that before Mastery. It's good to see that retz become a viable training spot, and I figured Magatia would be another spot that they'd get excellent exp at. However, for retz, I probably wouldn't start training there til the lower 4x at the earliest, and likely the same is true for those sort of Magatia maps although more likely the earliest for them are lower 5x. So, unless it improves my training from 30-36, which are the annoying levels imo, I think I'll do one Soul Blade, then max mastery, then Soul Blade, with Soul Runner thrown in there somewhere. If Soul Blade is as good as suggested, I may do the 2 mastery, 1 Soul Blade after I get mastery to a decent amount.

I really wouldn't mind leaving the 1 soulblade at lvl 30

are there things like dexless warriors or do they miss alot

are there things like dexless warriors or do they miss alot

Dexless warriors exist, and well-funded ones do not miss on anything. Be sure to post in the "Ask a warrior"-thread next time, as this has nothing or little to do with KoC!

(If you're wondering, I suppose Dawn Warriors have the same accuracy-formula as other warriors.)

Why Soul Runner right away.
1. Your going to be in Cpq you will barely need to move around alot.
Room 1-2 you do
Room 3-4 just stay in the middle and mob
Room 5-6 go to the 2 Robo's or 3 Rombots
I think you should put soul runner for after pqing maybe have it max at lvl 56.

would it be smart to make soul blade 21 b4 i do mastery and booster?

here and at the cygnus skill tables elsewhere on the site max soul blade is 180% to 5 monsters, but on basil's dawn warrior "guide", ayumilove was quoted as it being 220% to 5 monsters. It also states there that the range remains constant throughout all the levels. If someone knowledgeable could clarify, that would be awesome.

here and at the cygnus skill tables elsewhere on the site max soul blade is 180% to 5 monsters, but on basil's dawn warrior "guide", ayumilove was quoted as it being 220% to 5 monsters. It also states there that the range remains constant throughout all the levels. If someone knowledgeable could clarify, that would be awesome.

It's 180%, Ayumilove has old and some wrong information.

Whenever I'm making my Soul Master, I'm going to be maxing my 'Soul' sprite and not Power Strike. Reasons?

-Played a Warrior before (and got it to PADK, at that!)
-Power Strike < Slash Blast, mobbing > 1hitKO per target(s).
-It'd be nice to have a USEFUL summoning anyways, even if the damage is crap, it still lasts long, and it looks cool.

Unlike the 2nd job build listed here, I'll be getting lv 6 Sword Booster as soon as my Mastery lets me, which I think is EITHER lv 3 or 5 Mastery iirc, been a while since I got booster on my last Warrior.

Whenever I'm making my Soul Master, I'm going to be maxing my 'Soul' sprite and not Power Strike. Reasons?

-Played a Warrior before (and got it to PADK, at that!)
-Power Strike < Slash Blast, mobbing > 1hitKO per target(s).
-It'd be nice to have a USEFUL summoning anyways, even if the damage is crap, it still lasts long, and it looks cool.

Unlike the 2nd job build listed here, I'll be getting lv 6 Sword Booster as soon as my Mastery lets me, which I think is EITHER lv 3 or 5 Mastery iirc, been a while since I got booster on my last Warrior.

Slash Blast becomes useless in early 4x (45 ish, give or take). Soul Blade replaces it completely by then. Even earlier if someone chose to max it before Mastery, I guess, which would be weird...but whatever. Point is: Slash Blast is only useful to carry you to Soul Blade.

Power Strike may not be very useful in the early levels, but it is certainly a necessary skill. There will be many times where you need a quick hit to deal with a straggler or something. Or if you wish to do the BPQ/area bossing. Simply, it's just GOOD to have a single hit skill, rather than bogging yourself down with mob skills only. I'd rather be able to handle more situations.

Soul is ABSOLUTELY, NO DEBATE terrible. It is NOT useful. It is ONLY helpful (and even that is slightly) during 1st job and kind of early 2nd job. Level 11 (hell, even 1) is enough to serve its purpose. It quickly reaches the point where you wonder WHY you're still casting it. Trust me on this. It's a massive joke of a skill, which you will definitely realize by 4x, at the latest.

Not saying you can't do it, of course. Whatever you want and whatever you think is fun. I'm just saying it's a terrible use of your points.

would it be smart to make soul blade 21 b4 i do mastery and booster?

Some people do it, but I wouldn't suggest doing that unless your grinding with 4x from level 30 - 50.

If your planning on CPQing from level 30 - 50, get mastery first.
Why?

Reason 1.
130% damage + 60% mastery > 180% damage + 10% mastery.
Sure, soul blade is a ranged attack, but remember, it only hits 5 monsters opposed to slash blast, which hits 6 monsters. Also in CPQ, all the monsters are mobbed up together, so Soul Blade wouldn't have an edge over slash blast, Sould Blade would be doing crappy damage to 2 or 3 out of the 5 monster it hits due to the 10% mastery.

Reason 2.
Some people seem to forget that Mastery also gives accuracy.
As a dexless Dawn Warrior/Soul Master, I find that 19 accuracy VERY life saving, as I don't get my zhelm, dex PAC etc. until level 50.

Reason 3.
People say that training with soul blade is more efficient than training with Slash blast, which is true.... only if your killing the same kind of monsters.
If you wanna go to truckers at level 40 for EXP heaven without having to use a crappy maple sword, get mastery first.

You would need around 96 accuracy to train at truckers.

Unless you have godly dex equips, low dex/dexless warriors won't reach 96 accuracy without mastery.

I actually changed my build... At lv 30, I have:

-Maxed Iron Body (20 SPs)
-Maxed Power Strike (20 SPs)
-Maxed Slash Blast (20 SPs)
-Lv 1 Soul (1)

Reasons? Lv 11 Soul is useless, lv 1 Soul only for fun and looks. I wanted Iron Body because even with +30 def, it's better than having 'no' def, and it's always cool to have more buffs, kekeke. For lv 30+, I'm still debating on my build for it, but I'll think as I go along. I'll probably have 1 Soul Blade, maxed Runner, then enough Mastery for get 6 Booster, then maxing Mastery, and finally then maxing Blade.

You mean 10 Improved HP Increase and 10 Iron Body, right?

-Maxed Iron Body (20 SPs)
-Maxed Power Strike (20 SPs)
-Maxed Slash Blast (20 SPs)
-Lv 1 Soul (1)

^Pretty much a fail warrior right there.