Jack Barricade's Clues

Yes, but again, why didn't he use the singular? He said "stone GOLEMS captured me" not "a stone GOLEM", so.. are there MORE than one of these enormous statues?

Lukan:There is a giant statue erect in his honor

Again, I'd say this qualifies as a "Giant statue", wouldn't you?
It seems more likely every minute that thats Crimsonheart.


I want to see how they fit his pirate mastery into it though, I mean, Lukan does specify that he mastered "All 4 classes"

Again, I'd say this qualifies as a "Giant statue", wouldn't you?
It seems more likely every minute that thats Crimsonheart.


I want to see how they fit his pirate mastery into it though, I mean, Lukan does specify that he mastered "All 4 classes"

Yeah, I still wonder how could he have mastered Pirate class.

Anyway, yeah, I'm 99% sure that's Crimsonheart. It just looks like him.. the face.. I can see the statue being Crimsonheart. I imagined him being something like that.

And yeah, I was apparently wrong. Jack says "some stone golem" not "stone golems", so.. I think Isaac is right. Well, that would've been the first time he wasn't.

Or he could have been taken by a flying creature made of stone. Thus, being able "to see everything".

It couldn't have been a flying monster since it was described as a stone golem. That's a pretty specific type of monster. The statue fits that name easily but who knows. I don't know if that statue is a boss or a monster or what. But to me it looks like it is something significant. It doesn't just look like another background object. If anything it sticks out from the background.

I VERY much doubt that the huge statue is a stone golem. Jack was being *carried around* by the golem, so that means the golems move. Does CWK look large enough for that statue to move about freely to you?

Yeah I'm now thinking the picture is the Statue dedicated to Crimsonheart.



He may not have had 4 arms(but then he might!) and the statue doesnt have to be a literal image of him. It is dedicated to his "Mastery of 4 Disciplines" (even if they gave him a bow when he's supposed to be a Marksman)

We may not have seen the Stone Golems yet...

They're not exact counterparts. Actually, that's why I brought up the "Female Grandmaster Mage" point - Lukan describes Delgrund as being the Grandmaster in his time, and Delgrund was male. These are not the same people, nor are they mirror counterparts.

A female Mage would be a mirror counterpart of a male Mage.

Yeah I'm now thinking the picture is the Statue dedicated to Crimsonheart.



He may not have had 4 arms(but then he might!) and the statue doesnt have to be a literal image of him. It is dedicated to his "Mastery of 4 Disciplines" (even if they gave him a bow when he's supposed to be a Marksman)

We may not have seen the Stone Golems yet...

Just because it says he was also a master marksman doesn't mean he used a crossbow.

A female Mage would be a mirror counterpart of a male Mage.

You have your definition of mirror or counterpart or both screwed up. A mirror of something is a copy, but it's backwards. A counterpart is a duplicate of something. A female mage could be the counterpart of a male mage, but she could not be a mirror counterpart.

Simply, mirror does not mean opposite (unless in direction). Or do you look in a mirror, as a male, and see a female?

:O

Mirrored in the sense that she is evil instead of good, counterpart in the sense that she is a she instead of a he. (lol)

Hmmm, what if Subani and Christopher Crimsonheart are one and the same?

Perhaps that's why there was no big ceremony. Cristopher Crimsonheart was just a persona used by Subani to temporarily help Maplers and the Mapleworld. It would explain some things I think. After he "died" as Christopher Crimsonheart, maybe he went on to master the pirate skills as far as incorporating them into things. It might be that in his grave, he left some sort of way to find him if need be.

Of course I think it would be rather interesting if Cristopher Crimsonheart is the opposite of the Black Magician. Perhaps both are avatars for the enduring struggle between Subani and Naricain. Or they could be Subani and Naricain, or it could be they're both apprentices of each of them. Perhaps they're the children or the spouses to each of them? After all I'm pretty sure they've never specified what genders Subani or Naricain were, assuming they had such things, just as they haven't specified family or many other things. So many possibilities at the moment it's hard to say for sure.

Speaking of the two of them, has anyone considered that the Antelion might actually be what Subani sealed Naricain away in? Perhaps that was why he founded the Keep; to guard over the captured demon and prevent the dark forces from reawakening him. Which leads us possibly to the Black Magican or some other dark force awakening or freeing him. However maybe Subani set a spell trap, as insurance so that the continent would vanish to Versal or somewhere else if something like that happened. Or perhaps the reawakening/freeing warped the fabric of reality and/or time and made it vanish. Could it be he was the darkness that fell upon the world of Versal and ate up much of the sun?

Anyway, I'm fairly sure that the puppetmaster behind the scenes in Masteria is Naricain . . . or the Black Magician . . . or Naricain acting through the Black Magician. XP Sometimes it's just too hard to tell where they're going to go with things.

So in total, I think maybe the PQ is to find Cristopher Crimsonheart/Subani before the dark forces can. Perhaps after doing that, we'll get Versal, and have to travel over there to put a halt to the dark forces there. Of course that doesn't mean the defeat of the dark forces, it just means they'll pop up somewhere else in all likelihood. Perhaps they'll even do limited time events similar to the Haunted House in NLC, minus the NX. Something along the lines where it changes the Maple world permanently? Or at least makes it permanently changed for those that do it. Perhaps the pqs can still be repeated, however it's more a clean up action or something along those lines? Or perhaps a training dummy brought about by Subani after you defeat them the first time to keep your skills honed for whenever the real one must be defeated again?

Hmmm, well, I guess that's all that I can think of for now. Perhaps NxProse's answers will reveal more.

Mirrored in the sense that she is evil instead of good, counterpart in the sense that she is a she instead of a he. (lol)

Well, this really is a stupid thing to be arguing. What Isaac said wasn't wrong because he has the right idea about what "mirror" means. Mirrored does not mean what you are trying to make it mean. I'll support Isaac's statement with a definition, since that now seems necessary:

"Something that faithfully reflects or gives a true picture of something else."

Source: Dictionary.com, "mirrored" (searching "mirror" will only give you more proof)

An evil, female mage is not a mirror counterpart of a good, male mage for two reasons. Evil is not a mirror of good. Female is a not a mirror of male (the reason Isaac was using).

Correctly, they are all evil counterparts of the Grandmasters. That is the accurate way to describe them.

Well, this really is a stupid thing to be arguing. What Isaac said wasn't wrong because he has the right idea about what "mirror" means. Mirrored does not mean what you are trying to make it mean. I'll support Isaac's statement with a definition, since that now seems necessary:

"Something that faithfully reflects or gives a true picture of something else."

Source: Dictionary.com, "mirrored" (searching "mirror" will only give you more proof)

An evil, female mage is not a mirror counterpart of a good, male mage for two reasons. Evil is not a mirror of good. Female is a not a mirror of male (the reason Isaac was using).

Correctly, they are all evil counterparts of the Grandmasters. That is the accurate way to describe them.

I'm not trying to make mirrored mean anything, I'm only using game logic to describe the evil female Mage and the good male Mage.

Game logic does not match up with real world logic so it would be foolish to use the real world definition of mirror/mirrored.

I'm not trying to make mirrored mean anything, I'm only using game logic to describe the evil female Mage and the good male Mage.

Game logic does not match up with real world logic so it would be foolish to use the real world definition of mirror/mirrored.

Oh lawds!

OKAY, YOU'RE RIGHT. NEXON = DEVOID OF LOGIC. THEREFORE, WHATEVER DOES NOT MAKE SENSE, MAKES SENSE.

YES.

Nexon is even above definitions of simple words! Is there any place in the text that Nexon referred to them as "mirror counterparts"? (I dunno) If they did, they are wrong. They are evil counterparts. But that's fine 'cause they're Nexon.

However, Isaac was not wrong because he actually used it right. You can't use Nexon logic against Isaac because he isn't Nexon, nor does he lack intelligence.

OKAY MAN. HEAVEN OR HELL.

LET'S ROCK.

What the hell dude? I never said anything of the sort.

I said I was basing my posts off of game logic which is different from real world logic, excuse me for using game logic for MapleStory.

In just about any game where there is a mirrored version of a good character that character is evil, hence good being mirrored with evil.

But whatever the flipping flying f'uck you want to call it I still think there is, or was a Versalian version of Chirstopher Crimsonheart himself.

It says Christopher mastered four jobs, yet the statue has a gun. Were pirates known in Crimsonheart's time? I thought they just recently came to Victoria...? I know Lukan would have no knowledge of pirates either though, considering he's from the past.

Also, with nothing to do with the above:
Wasn't there once a mistakenly placed World Map of Amoria with the Dragon Clan door in the middle of it?

What the hell dude? I never said anything of the sort.

I said I was basing my posts off of game logic which is different from real world logic, excuse me for using game logic for MapleStory.

In just about any game where there is a mirrored version of a good character that character is evil, hence good being mirrored with evil.

But whatever the flipping flying f'uck you want to call it I still think there is, or was a Versalian version of Chirstopher Crimsonheart himself.

lol Sorry for misunderstanding then. I assumed game logic meant Nexon logic, as Maplestory is the game in question. That's my bad.

I still don't get why you're insistent on using mirrored, though. The world of games doesn't change the definitions of the real world. If games have their own definitions for words or something, that's fine, but those don't hold valid outside that game. In another point, using "game logic" doesn't work as a blanket statement because I know of games that do use the correct definition of mirrored (example: Mario Kart's "mirror mode" which is a backwards version of the courses). What are some games that use mirrored in the way you're describing (and actually call it "mirror")?

Honestly, I'm probably just being a technicality whore for fun and time-killing. So forgive me.

one thing to think of is that Nexon has proven to over state themselves (might not be the right word), in the sense they will have one NPC say one thing, but is completely reversed by another NPC, such as Fiona saying that she created the Crimson weapons, and then having one of the Sages saying that the crimson weapons were the heart and pride of the Keep in its peak of glory. That would completely make you say "what?" when you read them together.

lol Sorry for misunderstanding then. I assumed game logic meant Nexon logic, as Maplestory is the game in question. That's my bad.

I still don't get why you're insistent on using mirrored, though. The world of games doesn't change the definitions of the real world. If games have their own definitions for words or something, that's fine, but those don't hold valid outside that game. In another point, using "game logic" doesn't work as a blanket statement because I know of games that do use the correct definition of mirrored (example: Mario Kart's "mirror mode" which is a backwards version of the courses). What are some games that use mirrored in the way you're describing (and actually call it "mirror")?

Honestly, I'm probably just being a technicality whore for fun and time-killing. So forgive me.

In all fairness, "mirrored" sounds way more kickass than "evil counterpart"

So people were right about the grave being involved with a pq at least..

it may or may not be. Its more likely to be involved in a quest at least.

Someone earlier said the PQ is probably the process of delaying the planned attack on Crimsonheart's grave. I think the grave itself will be a defend style thing like el nath PQ, they're inevitably going to attack.