War in Ukraine?

I don't see how my examples prove your point. Yes, China has gone to great lengths in the past to express its own agenda in the face of Western influence, but I am arguing that they are not going to side with Russia in this case simply because it would antagonize the West. China doesn't get much out of blindly supporting Russia after they disregard the sovereignty of another nation.

They do when that other nation's stability is of good interest to China. The reason I pointed out your points are supportive is because China/Russia share their ideologies (see Syria) but because of their position they're forced to remain passive about it. Now if war broke out, I could see China backing Russia in what should be our victories like North Korea

This is actually a concern for China and they are likely feeling wary about Russia's recent imperialist foreign policy change.

This I'm not familiar with

And I wasn't questioning your source, just was explaining why I can't read it currently but appreciate the link, it's also recent but I have not seen the same perspective echo'd anywhere else which is odd to me. Doesn't make it any less valid or anything of that nature

They do when that other nation's stability is of good interest to China. The reason I pointed out your points are supportive is because China/Russia share their ideologies (see Syria) but because of their position they're forced to remain passive about it. Now if war broke out, I could see China backing Russia in what should be our victories like North Korea

Yes, in the case of war, I agree with you. Fortunately I don't really see the powers going to actual war over Ukraine.

This I'm not familiar with

And I wasn't questioning your source, just was explaining why I can't read it currently but appreciate the link, it's also recent but I have not seen the same perspective echo'd anywhere else which is odd to me. Doesn't make it any less valid or anything of that nature

Not a problem. I just thought I'd explain kind of where I got it from. It's rather interesting, I really haven't seen any statements or press releases from the Chinese government concerning Ukraine. That's why I brought the article here in the first place.

This was the cover of Finnish Donald Duck last week:



Can you notice the symbolism?

 Captain Obvious

Donald (Ukraine) is trying to escape towards the west, but the bear (Russia) is standing on Donald's heels (Crimea). In addition, the background and title colors are the exact tones of those in Ukraines flag.

[MENTION=5103]Satellite[/MENTION];

Is there a specific reason that Donald is Ukraine? I understand all the symbolism, but I don't get the reference if there is one.

Satellite;

Is there a specific reason that Donald is Ukraine? I understand all the symbolism, but I don't get the reference if there is one.

Blue and yellow colours on his clothing i guess.

I read through some threads, some wiki articles, and this thread. But I still don't understand why this is such a 'hot' issue for the U.S. to be concerned about. Even considering Russia's involvement in this issue, what advantages would the Ukraine give Russia if they decided to annex the country via military proxy that would lead Russia towards being more competitive in terms of economic and military strength? As far as I know, there are more flaws than draws if Russia pushes ahead in terms of the long term benefits since it will give the U.S. an excuse to launch sanctions against Russia and cripple them economically. That leads to the U.S. benefiting from a hostile Russia move towards the country since it will likely loosen the country from Putin's influence and allow the U.S. to gamble on another president that would be more open towards cooperation with their foreign policy.

The Daily Show framed both republican representatives and conservative media as highlighting the situation in order to question Obama's leadership qualities in comparison to Putin's to frame him as characteristically being weak and timid. "Mom's jeans" was the byword that they repeatedly used to characterize Obama while idolization was placed on Putin wrestling tigers. It was ironically contrasted with similar coverage from a year ago of the Affordable Care Act where they were accusing Obama of being a dictator and tyrant who was blatantly bypassing the idea of a separation of powers via this piece of legislation. Conservative media alone though does not constitute the entirety of American news. However, If Sorkin's Newsroom is any indication of what happens in a real news room, there is a pandering element to reporting that if a news station is featuring a piece of news that someone sees as 'hot', then every news station at least tries to put it on air in order to not be condemned for having no coverage on a issue that becomes blown up because other stations featured it resulting in elevating its importance to American consciousness. The show highlights that fad reporting is the corporate memo.

I find the Daily Show's explanation to be a bit too cynical, although it may have been presented that way in order to compliment the show's singular way of presenting all news as black comedy. However, I am openly cynical about our liberty thumping American sense of righteousness given the opposition funding we've given to resistance groups and the more outright invasions we've initiated to topple down regimes that the White House has viewed as hostile and uncooperative towards U.S. agenda.

I read through some threads, some wiki articles, and this thread. But I still don't understand why this is such a 'hot' issue for the U.S. to be concerned about. Even considering Russia's involvement in this issue, what advantages would the Ukraine give Russia if they decided to annex the country via military proxy that would lead Russia towards being more competitive in terms of economic and military strength? As far as I know, there are more flaws than draws if Russia pushes ahead in terms of the long term benefits since it will give the U.S. an excuse to launch sanctions against Russia and cripple them economically. That leads to the U.S. benefiting from a hostile Russia move towards the country since it will likely loosen the country from Putin's influence and allow the U.S. to gamble on another president that would be more open towards cooperation with their foreign policy.

Russia does not want Ukraine to go towards the EU because it knows if that happens, it will be very likely that Ukraine will join NATO as well. Russia is still very on-edge about NATO in general and will not tolerate having a NATO member that close. Also Russia is a raw export economy still and Ukraine is very dependent on Russia for its energy.

Also there's a good article about China's foreign policy dilemma with Ukraine in this week's Economist.

I read through some threads, some wiki articles, and this thread. But I still don't understand why this is such a 'hot' issue for the U.S. to be concerned about. Even considering Russia's involvement in this issue, what advantages would the Ukraine give Russia if they decided to annex the country via military proxy that would lead Russia towards being more competitive in terms of economic and military strength? As far as I know, there are more flaws than draws if Russia pushes ahead in terms of the long term benefits since it will give the U.S. an excuse to launch sanctions against Russia and cripple them economically. That leads to the U.S. benefiting from a hostile Russia move towards the country since it will likely loosen the country from Putin's influence and allow the U.S. to gamble on another president that would be more open towards cooperation with their foreign policy

Russia desperately needs Ukraine to fulfill their economic and military goals for the future. I'm sure you have understand why Putin desires Crimea, but he wants the rest of the Urkaine as well. Russia has for a while now been seeking a Eurasian bloc that could compete outside of Western influence. Ukraine is also an important part of that as an important food source for China and Russia.

As far as all of these sanctions letting the US get the political upperhand on Russia, I think that is a misconception. There is a pretty interesting article in the New York Times (yes, that's a link and not an ad) that talks about growing Anti-American/Western sentiment and how some Russian elites are using these sanctions as an excuse to move towards closer ties with China. As far as public opinion goes, I do not think Putin is very concerned.

Some information I got from my High School history teach today while he was also giving some A+ information on WWII.

>The current administration is too scared to do anything to Russia, while during our past administration, George W. Bush single-handily stopped Putin from doing what he was planning on doing.
>Russia knows the current administration is the weakest in our history, so Russia is doing what they are doing because of that.
>Just like the appeasement during WWII to Germany, that is what the US is doing now because the current administration is too scared.
>US isolationism just like in WWII
>"Let me give you an example of what Russia's invasion of Ukraine is like: Let's say there are Russians in the Seattle population, then Russia would come in and invade Seattle, and say "This is ours now.""
>"Another example would be the Italians wanting to protect the Italians in New York, they would then take over New York and say "This is ours now."

At the same time during the "lecture" he was talking well of US neutrality in WWII until we came in and fought the battle of Normandy- "We got the toughest beach-but that's okay because we were the toughest country"(murica') then we single hand-idly stopped Germany because we were the "big dogs"(murica')

good stuff.

Some information I got from my High School history teach today while he was also giving some A+ information on WWII.

>The current administration is too scared to do anything to Russia, while during our past administration, George W. Bush single-handily stopped Putin from doing what he was planning on doing.
>Russia knows the current administration is the weakest in our history, so Russia is doing what they are doing because of that.
>Just like the appeasement during WWII to Germany, that is what the US is doing now because the current administration is too scared.
>US isolationism just like in WWII
>"Let me give you an example of what Russia's invasion of Ukraine is like: Let's say there are Russians in the Seattle population, then Russia would come in and invade Seattle, and say "This is ours now.""
>"Another example would be the Italians wanting to protect the Italians in New York, they would then take over New York and say "This is ours now."

At the same time during the "lecture" he was talking well of US neutrality in WWII until we came in and fought the battle of Normandy- "We got the toughest beach-but that's okay because we were the toughest country"(murica') then we single hand-idly stopped Germany because we were the "big dogs"(murica')

good stuff.

It's always fun to view history with several different tinted glasses.

>Just like the appeasement during WWII to Germany, that is what the US is doing now because the current administration is too scared.
>"Let me give you an example of what Russia's invasion of Ukraine is like: Let's say there are Russians in the Seattle population, then Russia would come in and invade Seattle, and say "This is ours now.""
>"Another example would be the Italians wanting to protect the Italians in New York, they would then take over New York and say "This is ours now."

1. Crimea is not Munich. (I would plum punt your teach for even suggesting that Crimea is similar to Munich.)
2. Crimea has been Russian for a good period of time until Khrushchev sent it to Ukraine in the 50s (for whatever reason).

In an alternate timeline where Crimea has a legitimate referendum to leave Ukraine and join the Russian Federation, it should be respected. It is historically Russian and predominantly populated by Russians. Right now since Russia is tampering in Ukraine's affairs more than usual, it should not be respected. Either way it's probably going to be joining the Russian Federation anyways, either official or by proxy.

In other news, Putin's Netflix account has been frozen. Shots fired.

If some of you haven't seen this yet, in Russian tv, they talk about turning USA into radioactive ash:

[video=youtube;EkMT_oLempE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkMT_oLempE[/video]

There's also these quotes from a leaked FB discussion of a Russian official where they want to invade Alaska and Finland:

Roman Kokorev: Next step - all of Moldova and all Ukraine!!! And then - all other former territories of the USSR, Russia again concentrates and focuses, as always!
Roman Kokorev: Once the spiritual and military power is restored in Russia to it's full might, Alaska will return, and Baltics, and Poland, and Finland, they're all after all Russian territories, parts of Russia!

These quotes seem more and more like something North Korea would say.