The Hobbit

There was actually a council in the book? Because I don't remember one, and if not that entire scene felt utterly forced and ridiculous, a blatant method to include Christopher Lee and Cate Blanchett in the film for recognition status from fans and more adoration from film critics for finding parts for A-list actors.

It's definitely a blatant A-list scene grab but it would appear that the conversation at least did take part, though based on my re-read on the Hobbit it is unlikely that it took place when Thorin and co were present.

There was actually a council in the book? Because I don't remember one, and if not that entire scene felt utterly forced and ridiculous, a blatant method to include Christopher Lee and Cate Blanchett in the film for recognition status from fans and more adoration from film critics for finding parts for A-list actors.

Never in The Hobbit states the council, but you can gather information about what happened, although it might have not been an addition Tolkien would have made or add directly.

I do know for sure (and you can double check) that Gandalf did have a meeting with the highest members of the "council" (I'm not really sure what word in english they used, the reference appears on both the index and The Silmarillion). He even went as far as to say the elves asked him to lead it, refused it, and Saruman took the position in one of the two books, unsure of which.

The problem with all of this and why some of us extreme fans are a bit mad or doubting if it was actually a good choice to do this scenes as the filler material is because all of this information is scattered. This is where Jackson took most liberty, since it mentions it happened, doesn't exactly mentions: who (As in if all of them or just two or 3), how, when and where (It can be deduced Rivindell, but it never states so).

Just my two cents of info.


I would have loved an explanation of Galadriel, she is one of my favorite characters from Middle Earth, but a movie of The Silmarillion would be extremely hard to put off.

In regards to Bilbo, he's pretty much a burden in the books until the later parts but yes, he was never heroic like how the movie seems to want to make him look. To say he has no redeeming qualities seems far off the mark to me as his reasons may have been selfish but he still tries to do what he thinks is right for all sides (See: Giving the Arkenstone to Bard to make negotiations easier), it's just grating that they're making him look like a shining action hero when by and large Gandalf was right about him being a burglar in the sense of how he gets people out of trouble with stealth and cunning, traits that are not always appreciated in Hollywood heroes.

What they really should have done was to stick more true to the book. I am in agreement with you that it has its pros in terms of expansion but with the cost being character butchering it becomes less good of a movie than LOTR was to me.

What I meant by "no redeeming qualities", I was referring to physical prowess, and basically what Thorin and the others all saw in him, or the lack of what they saw. There is no doubt that Bilbo's intangible qualities are present and have a big effect on the story. My main issue has just been with the way the cast the character of Bilbo that took away what made him such an awesome character in the book.

What I meant by "no redeeming qualities", I was referring to physical prowess, and basically what Thorin and the others all saw in him, or the lack of what they saw. There is no doubt that Bilbo's intangible qualities are present and have a big effect on the story. My main issue has just been with the way the cast the character of Bilbo that took away what made him such an awesome character in the book.

That one I can agree with. Bilbo's the kind of character that doesn't immediately begin to look awesome which is what makes his character development amazing while what they've done here is to make him look heroic like the stereotypical protagonist, which is almost the furthest away from Bilbo as Bag End must be from Erebor. There's also the part about him 'wanting to reclaim the land for the dwarves' which is just plain idiotic; that is completely out of character for him.