What Pirate changes shall they be bringing to this arrrmazing class?

So I ACTUALLY read the OP after I posted, and I had a great laugh with my friend. Remarks in red.


You need to seriously think harder before posting something like this. If you're trolling (which I seriously hope you are) then kudos, it was a great troll.

1. Chillax; this is theory crafting, a thread to open the imagination, and for those to speak their mind. nothing is going to be blanaced obviously. There aren't set detailed numbers set either, so you can't really tell if things like damage or rush distance would be the "ZOMGWTFHAX" you were thinking of.

2. If you read other posts, you would see that other people ALSO disagreed with him on the perma-transform and energy things. It's not only you who noticed how not-so-balanced that would be.

3. If you think that there's something unbalanced about it, try to do something constructive instead of sarcasm on the internet. If you really think it's unbalanced say why you think so, and what would be "suitable" for the class. That is after all what this thread is about in the first place.

So I ACTUALLY read the OP after I posted, and I had a great laugh with my friend. Remarks in red.


You need to seriously think harder before posting something like this. If you're trolling (which I seriously hope you are) then kudos, it was a great troll.

Who are you? Who are you? You're trying to sound haughty on a brainstorming topic, where everyone's encouraged to put on the table all their ideas for Pirate improvement for everyone to discuss no matter how bad/good/overpowered it is, and also be able to bounce off other people's ideas on how to improve it. If you even bothered to read a little more you'd find people who didn't agree with my ideas and thought of something better or offered their own ideas on Pirate improvements. Acting high and mighty while missing the point is not going to get you anywhere. Thanks for laugh though.

That sounds more annoying than useful. You need to build a bar in order to transform and use skills like Demolition? Do not want, I'd rather use Demolition 90% of the time, like I can now, and transform at free will.

What I propose for Energy Mode is just make the Energy Bar a separate MP Bar that you fill with non-energy moves (SS Kick, Dragon Strike, Barrage, etc), which you can use right away and consume like a separate MP Bar. But when you reach full bar, you'll enter bubble mode which grants you bonus attack, 90% stance, and infinite energy moves spamming, that is, until the bubble mode wears off, and your Energy Bar is set to empty again (just like it happens now). Sounds really balanced to me.

Oh, and enable Energy Wave only in bubble mode so it's like our hyper energy move =). Not an ultimate, just a special move you can use for a more limited time, compared to Orb, which you can probably do a pair of Dragon Strikes and have enough Energy Bar to use Orb a pair of times, too.

It wouldn't feel annoying if the class was actually well designed and the skills weren't horribly mismatched. Snatch and Demo make no sense together, you'd be using Dragon Strike most of the time anyway. Nexon failed hard when they designed [Super]Transform. Transforming shouldn't change your entire playstyle, and it shouldn't give you skills you won't use. They attempted to fix this in Big Bang by letting you stay near-permanently Transformed so you don't have to deal with the mismatch very much, but it's a really sloppy fix. Transform could be something like 30 secs with a 2-minute cd, and I guarantee you would still love it, if they actually made it feel like a big power boost.

What I'd do:
- Make Snatch a clone of Monster Magnet, and make it usable normally. Animation changes required, I think.
- Drop the charge on Corkscrew Blow, make it reasonably powerful without charging
- Reduce Dragon Strike's range to 300% (about the same as warrior skills)
- Make Barrage a lot faster. (1830 ms -> ~ 1200 ms). Allow it to hit up to 3 mobs (80% damage on 2, 70% damage on 3)
- Change energy system to what you described. Possibly add an "Energy Wave" skill.
- Make Demolition an energy ability, and greatly buff the speed (2340 ms -> ~1200 ms). Allow it to hit up to 3 mobs (80% damage on 2, 70% damage on 3)
- Make Energy Orb do significantly more damage.
- Make Transform and Super Transform steroid skills that drop the delays on all of your skills significantly (think Demo at the speed of Brave Slash), increase your attack power, increase your speed and jump beyond the cap (maybe 180% speed 120% jump?), and improve the range of your Corkscrew Blow. Lasts 30s, 2 min cd.
- Adjust all skill % values for balance.

Idea behind these changes:

Buccaneers suffer from Evan syndrome. Their single target attacks are hideously slow, so you never want to use them while training. My proposed changes attempt to make Buccaneers less awkward and play more like Warriors. You run around smashing stuff with Barrage and Dragon Strike, and you have a Rush and a Monster Magnet. You have a "combo" resource - that's your Energy bar. When you have a lot of Energy, you can use it for Energy Orb or Demolition. Transform becomes a simple cd and does not provide you with any access to different skills. That way there's no disconnect when you transform; you just feel really pineappleing awesome because you're moving extremely fast and your attacks are a blur.

That's just what I'd do. I think that would make a pretty interesting class.

Less range for Dragon Strike? Oh god, please no. QQ

I need the range on Dragon Strike for a lot of reasons -- one being potion saving and the other being that certain mobs required for certain stuff in JMS are annoying when close-up (like the Master Crimson Guardians in CWK who seal like crazy, which are required to kill to obtain a key needed before you can enter CWKPQ), so using Dragon Strike to keep them at bay on the other side of my screen is needed.

The range on Dragon Strike is one of the things that makes it such a spam-happy skill. You'd be using Energy Orb a lot more.

I guess Buccaneers could use a lot more avoid, too.

You'd be using Energy Orb a lot more.

Only if DS had less range than BSB. Orb isn't advantageous at all in horizontal range.

I guess Buccaneers could use a lot more avoid, too.

I definitely have to agree to this. Though... I don't know how it is post-Chaos. Would my 700 avoid mean anything after Chaos? If not, yeah... we need a lot more avoid.


Also, Steve is right. Energy Orb's range blows chunks and is only good if you hit a monster first. That's only if there's a string of monsters behind that first monster within the bounce range.

I definitely have to agree to this. Though... I don't know how it is post-Chaos. Would my 700 avoid mean anything after Chaos? If not, yeah... we need a lot more avoid.

While I heard the chaos patch changed avoid and accuracy a bit, I think it was only for hitting monsters above level range. If it maintains the current player based avoid formula, then 700 avoid doesn't mean much. Currently at LHC, there's very very very little difference between 500 avoid and 2500 (as my DB friends said while comparing with a sair). Buccs probably need a "GUARD" skill that functions off of a set percentage rather than a boost to raw avoid.

Buccs probably need a "GUARD" skill that functions off of a set percentage rather than a boost to raw avoid.

Well, if they were to do as Dusk suggested, then it would make sense for Super Transform to have something like a block + kb effect like Guardian does, but make it so the effect is passive and then has a higher chance of activating when the player is transformed. After all, blocking is just as important as attacking to a fist fighter.

I think there could be many simple changes taking advantage of newer introduced skill mechanics.

Reading back through the thread, I agree with Pirate's Revenge general contradiction to the gunslinger class branch gameplay, and...

I stopped playing my captain because I just loathed how the battleship made EVERYTHING YOU EVER LEARNED HOW TO PLAY A GUNSLINGER completely OBSOLETE.

A Corsair's fourth job felt like a completely different class with different gameplay; now in ways, an inferior Mech. It was like the transition from Double Shot to Triple Shot (Burst Fire?) - one designed to replace the other (literally), no true distinction, other than being more like an inferior Mech - slower (more so in terms of mobility) and more powerful on a single target.

Corsairs have always relied too much on a boss being stationary or being KB-able.

In regards to all classes, Dusk made a post a while ago about exponential HP (and other stats?) growth, and it could probably be implemented as passive skills. A form of stance could probably be implemented in every class - addressing filler game mechanics in this chat/customization game.

Just thought of a baller change/replacement for double upper. Whirlwind blow. Punches twice like double upper and then kicks with a spin, hitting three times (as fast as double upper probs) and leaving the character facing the opposite direction. I-frames optional.

The range on Dragon Strike is one of the things that makes it such a spam-happy skill. You'd be using Energy Orb a lot more.

I guess Buccaneers could use a lot more avoid, too.

avoid is 100% useless if you want to activate counterattack in 4th job between all your iframes.

most of the ideas on this thread plainly suck, and ruin the style of the bucc, trying to fix things that aren't broken, and beefing up things that are already good.

i actually did like the barrage as a hurricane style move. for about three seconds, then you realize you lose all the precious iframes. however, i think iframes are cheap and useless personally, but it seems they won't be going anywhere, so i'm ok with using them. anyway, some of my ideas (i posted them on basil before):

-in general, all attacks should be faster, and about 15-50% weaker. faster attacks mean less iframes, which is a good thing (they're cheap).
-snatch can be used outside of ST, except it costs like 200 mp at level one (and goes down to 100)
-brawling mastery grants you a 25% immunity to stun
-stun mastery gives you a 5% chance to stun with any attack at max level.
-4th job DoT: bleeding. max level 10. level 1: 5% damage every second, duration 10 seconds proc rate 5%. level 10: 50% damage every second, duration 15 seconds, proc rate 10%
-final attack. proc rate 30%, damage 210%, a comical POW!! or various punching onamatopoiea appear as the animation. has a mortal blow effect, 20% chance to activate on monsters below 25% hp.
-time leap's cooldown should be more like 12 minutes at max, level 20
-as stated before, faster barrage and demo cast, decreased damage to keep it balanced.
-barrel adds 300 w.def, 300 m.def. is the foot color still glitched? if so, fix that, haha.
-training montage: 4th job, max level 10, passive adds 15% mastery, 999 w.def, 999 mdef, passive.
-csb charge time SLIGHTLY faster
-oh and god, PLEASE fix the rushing glitch when other people are attacking the same monster as you
-keep SI animation, but add a tiny tornado animation around your character and party
-change MP recovery animation to a comical bottle of "somethin" that appears in front of your characters face, tilts, and the contents dissapears.
-able to keep energy bubble up like arans combo. the bar slowly drains unless you keep attacking, good for bossing. or make it fill slightly faster against bosses than it currently does
-change DS animation to some sea monster, dragons are lame, and for drks, not pirates.
-make energy orb stronger, and not decrease in as much damage across monsters

PAY ATTENTION NEXON

ETA: i kind of like the idea of a blocking skill... make it 3rd job, with a 10% proc, doesn't work on magic attacks. then have some 4th job skill (training montage?!) make it 15%, and add a magic attack blocking at 8-10% of the time. OR 15% as well, but only when orb is up

avoid is 100% useless if you want to activate counterattack in 4th job between all your iframes.

So is wasting time getting hit trying to activate it. Russellon's potion = best option.

i actually did like the barrage as a hurricane style move. for about three seconds, then you realize you lose all the precious iframes. however, i think iframes are cheap and useless personally, but it seems they won't be going anywhere, so i'm ok with using them.

Only the idiots who came up with hurricane barrage suggested it be stronger than demo. It shouldn't be our strongest attack. That's stupid.

Only the idiots who came up with hurricane barrage suggested it be stronger than demo. It shouldn't be our strongest attack. That's stupid.

I don't mind if Barrage was Hurricane speed but weak so it's our new way to build up Energy, but it still brings up the issue that having incredibly long delays on our best/strongest attacks only serve to hurt our damage output. I know you like Demolition's long animation because it keeps Bodyguards and Grandpa Boss pinned, but speed simply reigns supreme in this game (or you can say Nexon can't balance slow but strong attacks with faster ones so DPS is equal). My biggest gripe with Demolition mainly lies in that the delay where you're just standing there before you can attack again is very atrocious and feels clunky. I'd like to see that after-delay get removed, so the moment you're done with Demolition you immediately enter into another one. Demo can also use maybe 2 more hits or so.

Alternatively, I want to know if you yourself think Demolition can become better than it is now.

Demolition's animation has the right length. If they remove the delay, we're basically invincible forever, lol (you could cast Demo just a milisecond after your invincibility goes off), and if they make the animation shorter, say bye to pin ability and invincibility frames, and might as well just call us Shadowers.

What does Demo need? Moar damage, period. Simplest solution. The attack is too slow? Make it stronger to compensate. The attack is too fast? (see: Hurricane), make it weaker to compensate. That's why Hurricane is 200% and Dragon Strike is 700%, but soon to be 850%. Buffing the damage and not the speed is the right thing to do.

Edit: Accordingly, "Barrage-Hurricane" should be weaker to compensate, and lower DPS than Demo. It's just a training skills for handy situations such as finishing off a single mob, or charging energy. Also, outside of Dojo you use Barrage's invincibility frames for FUCKING NOTHING.

avoid is 100% useless if you want to activate counterattack in 4th job between all your iframes.

most of the ideas on this thread plainly suck, and ruin the style of the bucc, trying to fix things that aren't broken, and beefing up things that are already good.

The current Buccaneer style is disjointed. Your skills have completely random ranges. Your AoE skills cast way faster than your single target skills. Your Energy chargeup builds up to a skill that only sees situational use for its quirky range. Super Transform is just plain weird. It has 90% uptime and the skills you gain from it have nothing to do with your other skills. You're talking about tiny patch ups that don't address larger playstyle issues. Which is understandable since you actually play a Buccaneer, enjoy the current playstyle, and just want some improvements to your class of course, but I'm looking at it from a design standpoint and it just plain doesn't make any sense.

Counterattack is a stupid mechanic. "Make sure you get hit a couple times every 50 seconds." It needs to be changed.

So is wasting time getting hit trying to activate it. Russellon's potion = best option.



Only the idiots who came up with hurricane barrage suggested it be stronger than demo. It shouldn't be our strongest attack. That's stupid.

but getting hit is how you activate it... just tank something while you attack it, it's not hard, oryou can just stand on something when you have orb and spam drain until it activates. avoid is useless when you have counterattack.

and i actually thought they meant barrage would work just like hurricane, like hold down on the attack. but yeah, you're right, demo should be the strongest.

..make demo work like hurricane? :f6:?

what I wish
vipers/buccs

a) get rid of shockwave. or basically allow it to be used in the air.
b) allow demo + snatch used in normal xform also

c) replace energy orb with an AOE. maybe unlike other aoe, once your charge is charged up, you can spam your aoe every 5 seconds, or alternatively, make energy charge fast charged (eg; 5~10 attacks = full charge) and you disperse the charge forming and aoe (like advance combo + coma).

d) make stance ability of energy charge = passive. (or let the energy charge stay until you disperse it using the aoe orb attack)

e) allow a taller hitbox for barrage. or allow barrage/ds be used in air.

f) better dps. basically we are short of shield+topwear/btmwear losing about 6 lines of potentials compared to a hero..

>make demo work like hurricane?

So you're forever floating over enemies being invincible? wut?

>a) get rid of shockwave. or basically allow it to be used in the air.

Create Shockwaves... in the air?

>b) allow demo + snatch used in normal xform also

Why? You're transformed 90% of the time anyway.

I don't mind if Barrage was Hurricane speed but weak so it's our new way to build up Energy, but it still brings up the issue that having incredibly long delays on our best/strongest attacks only serve to hurt our damage output. I know you like Demolition's long animation because it keeps Bodyguards and Grandpa Boss pinned, but speed simply reigns supreme in this game (or you can say Nexon can't balance slow but strong attacks with faster ones so DPS is equal). My biggest gripe with Demolition mainly lies in that the delay where you're just standing there before you can attack again is very atrocious and feels clunky. I'd like to see that after-delay get removed, so the moment you're done with Demolition you immediately enter into another one. Demo can also use maybe 2 more hits or so.

Alternatively, I want to know if you yourself think Demolition can become better than it is now.

Demolition overall getting a speed increase most likely won't change a thing except our DPS, because where there's a speed increase there's a delay decrease since the delay is part of it to my understanding. If the cast time gets cut in half, so should the delay. I'd rather they don't mess with the skill at all except for how much damage it does though. I like my main 1v1 attack hitting more than once AND still having the power to hit 500k with extreme funding even if it is slow.

If they were to change anything at all about demolition BESIDES damage, speed, delay, or invincibility...i would want it to give a homing effect on the monster you hit with it which only goes away once you die. That, and castable in the air. Also, the last hit should deal 2x damage, because the animation itself suggests that the last hit is the strongest one.

If i were to add a mobility skill, i would make it part of snatch and have it work like amaterasu's chain in the latest marvel v capcom. Snatch becomes castable in air. In the air, snatch only hits one target. If a target is hit, launch the buccaneer in that direction a la super KB (movement delay included) and force a 5 second cooldown on snatch. On the ground, snatch is the same. In this way, the buccaneer is launched a far distance and will most likely be hit by the monster it grabbed (thus activating pirate's revenge).

Also, outside of Dojo you use Barrage's invincibility frames for pineappleING NOTHING.

Not true. I use the invincibility frames whenever i get the chance in pot cooldown situations. If i'm so far away that i can still be hit but there aren't any mobs around me, i'll use demo to escape a fatal blow in exchange for not hitting anything and being vulnerable when finished. With barrage i can stay alive without getting hit as long as i want as long as damage reflect doesn't get in the way...

but getting hit is how you activate it... just tank something while you attack it, it's not hard, oryou can just stand on something when you have orb and spam drain until it activates. avoid is useless when you have counterattack.

>Russellon's potion. Problems solved.