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Free Public College
#19
Luxeraph Wrote:I pom you due to the start of your post but this, this is just stupid, how come people are this stupid in the states? or is it that the government requires them to have certified people? am I wrong or don't they also ask for experience too and thus why it's hard for a newly graduates to get a job?

It's basically what Sapta has said. It's the norm, and because its the norm it's easier to sift through the masses of applications a company gets for one or two positions based on it. You have to have some amazing experience on paper to be considered for a position without a degree. Essentially, if you don't look amazing on paper your application gets tossed. That's how it is in the States, and that's why making college free won't help anything, it will just make it worse. If everyone has a Bachelor's because College is free, what's next? A higher education yet again, and undergraduate work will just be considered an extension of high school/basic education.

hadriel Wrote:There are a couple of issues that are fairly distinct yet inseparable from each other here.

(1) the purpose of education -- philosophically speaking and economically speaking.
(2) the state of education in today's world -- what people teach and learn in school, its effectiveness, and how they are taught.
(3) the worth of education -- the relevance and effectiveness of education to society, towards job-finding and towards the jobs we actually work at.
(4) the attitudes toward education -- by the students, and by the general public.

I'm only laying the ground for more decent arguments. I have a great deal to say about each of these. What actually has a great deal more relevance than what many people realise is "the relevance and effectiveness of education to society". A great deal remains unsaid when people comment about things like "people go through education/school and yet come out stupid", and I feel really upset about why such statements get uttered (on many counts).

Hadriel

Honestly, I believe the reason many people feel "people go through [college] and come out stupid" is because of two major factors:
1) College is already practically mandatory, at least in the US. I've known quite a few people who were there just because they had to be, and not because they cared about anything they were doing there. One example is my previous post, but a for second example: Want to play Football/Baseball/Basketball/Other Sport Here for the rest of your life? You still have to go through college, you still have to do all the "higher-education" stuff, even if it has no relevance at all to your wishes in life. How does college help you be a good ball player? Sure, there are college teams and such, but would those really exist if college was not a prerequisite to a professional sport? Sometimes players are chosen for Minor/Major leagues with an emphasis on the school they went to, and not how well they can play (For example, when Football games start on TV, they go through the roster and specifically state which school they went to, as if that was the deciding factor in their ability to play).

2) There are a lot of schools that are just poor quality. Many schools have teachers that have no idea what they are talking about. In fact, in the US, most teachers(but not all of them) are actually people who failed in their field, and their last resort is to teach it. Why are these people, who are too bad to hold a job, teaching us? It makes no sense. On the contrary, I know several people from other countries (like India) who have told me it's the complete opposite, and teachers there are the ones who have done their field for several decades and just want something to do after retiring, or enjoy teaching others their field. The few teachers I have that I respected and enjoyed their classes for are the teachers that were there because they liked it, but those are very few and very far in between(I think I can name 3 over 4 years).

As for your list, please understand this is from a US perspective; I don't know how it is in the rest of the world:
1) I believe the purpose of college education is to learn your desired field. It should be solely focused on that.
2) At least in the US, the state of education is abysmal. High School barely teaches how to read and write, and part of every major is how to read and write...again. The entire point of High School and below is to get you ready for the world, yet college re-does all of it. Why? When I first started college there were "aptitude tests" in reading, writing, and math. When I asked what happens if I do badly, I was told I'd just be put in a lower level class. That's ridiculous. If I can't read, write, or do math, I shouldn't be accepted to the school. I should be directed to a prep school or some other form of learning. College should not be focusing on teaching me everything all over again, but it is. By the time I finished my second year I basically had just finished high school again, with a few exceptions. I spent tens of thousands of dollars and learned almost nothing at all.
3) In its current state education is nearly useless, except to get a job. Almost every job has two weeks of starting training, even if you took a job that's exactly the same field you went to school for. In some scenarios I can understand this -- Special Software, special procedures, etc., but my first job retaught everything that was part of school as part of the new-hire training. So why did I go to school again? You just went over what I did!
Above that, run around on some random forums one day and see how well school taught people how to read and write. I'm not trying to say I'm perfect, but I've seen posts by people who claim to be English born, from the States, over 18, and they can barely write a coherent sentence.
4) Overall, it's pretty bad. Most students aren't in school to learn, but know that it's required to get further in life. That's how society sees education - If you don't have it you must be an idiot, when it's not even necessary for a lot of situations. I think the worst part is that most of the smart people in the world who have done amazing things never finished college, or never went in the first place. I'm not exactly sure where this ideal that education = intelligence came from, but since it's here and the standard it bites people in the ass.

I'm sure I'll get more downvotes for this post (if anyone even reads it, it's giant), however this is my opinion and thoughts on the subject(s).
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Messages In This Thread
Free Public College - by Eos - 2014-01-17, 11:38 AM
Free Public College - by Niernen - 2014-01-17, 11:57 AM
Free Public College - by Malthe - 2014-01-17, 12:07 PM
Free Public College - by Jamesie - 2014-01-17, 12:48 PM
Free Public College - by Dudewitbow - 2014-01-17, 12:56 PM
Free Public College - by Eos - 2014-01-17, 01:12 PM
Free Public College - by SaptaZapta - 2014-01-17, 01:16 PM
Free Public College - by Words - 2014-01-17, 02:13 PM
Free Public College - by hadriel - 2014-01-17, 07:43 PM
Free Public College - by Jamesie - 2014-01-17, 08:12 PM
Free Public College - by MuscleWizard - 2014-01-17, 08:16 PM
Free Public College - by Words - 2014-01-17, 08:25 PM
Free Public College - by Link - 2014-01-17, 08:47 PM
Free Public College - by Polantaris - 2014-01-17, 09:53 PM
Free Public College - by DarkForgeJ - 2014-01-17, 10:36 PM
Free Public College - by Luxeraph - 2014-01-18, 04:16 AM
Free Public College - by SaptaZapta - 2014-01-18, 04:33 AM
Free Public College - by hadriel - 2014-01-18, 05:12 AM
Free Public College - by Polantaris - 2014-01-18, 06:27 AM
Free Public College - by hadriel - 2014-01-18, 06:50 AM
Free Public College - by Polantaris - 2014-01-18, 07:41 AM
Free Public College - by Flonne - 2014-01-18, 09:52 AM
Free Public College - by RayGun - 2014-01-18, 10:22 AM
Free Public College - by DarkForgeJ - 2014-01-18, 12:54 PM
Free Public College - by Lozmaster - 2014-01-18, 06:34 PM
Free Public College - by Eos - 2014-01-18, 06:39 PM
Free Public College - by hadriel - 2014-01-18, 07:53 PM
Free Public College - by WhatsThereToOoze - 2014-01-18, 09:42 PM
Free Public College - by Eos - 2014-01-18, 09:47 PM
Free Public College - by WhatsThereToOoze - 2014-01-18, 09:49 PM
Free Public College - by Jamesie - 2014-01-18, 10:10 PM
Free Public College - by Eos - 2014-01-18, 10:19 PM
Free Public College - by Sn1perJohnE - 2014-01-18, 10:20 PM
Free Public College - by hadriel - 2014-01-18, 10:36 PM
Free Public College - by Polantaris - 2014-01-19, 02:54 AM
Free Public College - by VerrKol - 2014-01-19, 05:25 AM
Free Public College - by SaptaZapta - 2014-01-19, 06:12 AM
Free Public College - by Eos - 2014-01-19, 12:07 PM
Free Public College - by hadriel - 2014-01-19, 12:59 PM
Free Public College - by Eos - 2014-01-19, 01:02 PM
Free Public College - by Polantaris - 2014-01-19, 03:48 PM
Free Public College - by Eos - 2014-01-19, 04:05 PM
Free Public College - by Five Second Pose - 2014-01-19, 04:34 PM
Free Public College - by Polantaris - 2014-01-19, 06:16 PM
Free Public College - by Tay - 2014-01-19, 10:37 PM
Free Public College - by Sardines - 2014-01-19, 10:46 PM
Free Public College - by Sephie - 2014-01-21, 09:18 AM
Free Public College - by Words - 2014-01-21, 10:26 AM
Free Public College - by Polantaris - 2014-01-21, 02:36 PM
Free Public College - by Sardines - 2014-01-23, 03:53 AM
Free Public College - by VerrKol - 2014-01-23, 05:20 AM
Free Public College - by Polantaris - 2014-01-23, 05:37 AM
Free Public College - by VerrKol - 2014-01-23, 03:35 PM
Free Public College - by Polantaris - 2014-01-23, 04:26 PM
Free Public College - by Takebacker - 2014-01-23, 05:29 PM
Free Public College - by Sardines - 2014-01-23, 10:55 PM
Free Public College - by Eos - 2014-01-23, 10:57 PM
Free Public College - by Sardines - 2014-01-24, 02:03 AM
Free Public College - by Polantaris - 2014-01-24, 02:25 AM
Free Public College - by KhainiWest - 2014-01-24, 10:10 AM
Free Public College - by Sardines - 2014-01-25, 02:29 AM
Free Public College - by KhainiWest - 2014-01-26, 10:42 PM
Free Public College - by Sardines - 2014-01-28, 11:30 AM

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