2013-04-20, 04:34 AM
I'm just going to move down the thread so I may mention things already covered.
Not in PDR ignore or OHKO rate possible ways .-. Or the ability to suck.
I believe he meant Achilles, not the apparent 'dumbing down'.
I believe it was more "spam Buster of Fury depending on the number of mobs". Sometimes, I certainly was in doubt. How could I tell how many there were in that crowd of mobs? Oh well, there was definitely more than 3I just Fury'd.
I don't know about you, but I found myself encountering mobs groups of all kinds of sizes when I trained a Dragon Knight. Then came LKC's Under the Castle Walls 1, where there were fewer mobs on the floating platforms (and therefore more Buster, but Fury definitely had more fun before the LKC levels, not to say that Buster had no fun at all), and more mobs on the ground platform (enough for Fury to be used and benefit you). It was like a map designed for Dragon Knights.
Dark Knights were 1000x better than they are now when Iron Will's duration wasn't lowered to 240 seconds. Then they had to add Hyper Body - Persist...
No one likes Hyper Body anymore, that's for sure. And they really moved away from the dragon theme after Ascension, changing from Dragon Knights with a dark spirit to an actual Dark Knight (reinforced by Dark Thirst and Potato), which would be cool if Demon Slayers and Demon Avengers didn't exist.
Because there would be too much work in finding out what to replace 60 SP (or 90 SP including Power Stance) worth of skills with. We already have so much spare SP thanks to Tempest. And then you'll also have to find which skills in 2nd and/or 3rd job to replace. Too much work for explorer warriors.
No, they both have their ups and downs. Decent Hyper Body cannot be dispelled and is less damaging to your draining ability (unless you need it) and syncs with Iron Will, but it costs more MP, adds less maximum HP and maximum MP (if you need it) and doesn't affect party members.
I love 'em.
Iron Will's duration. Lost. All 60 seconds. And then there's Dragon Blood's lovely pulse animation. Hex's animation also became a lot more of a rare occurrence, from every 4 seconds to every 100 seconds (unless you cancel the buff, which is troublesome, and even then, it has a 4 second frequency). I'm okay with that though, as there are now more variety/randomness in the symbols appearing.
Don't forget the extra 20 seconds! But really, no one will use hyper Hyper Body. I don't even use normal Hyper Body. Oh, and Iron Will? I don't even have SP in that piece of pomegranate.
I really don't want to have the old Berserk with the state of the game is in right now.
In my completely personal opinion, that was dumb and I hated the duplicate skills. And you could already choose your path when you advanced from 1st job.
Doesn't change the fact that 60% (80%) is twice as effective as 40% regardless of other % HP sources.
No, he's not. Buster is Cure and Fury is Shell (Fury isn't an improvement over Buster, but its damage to mob count counterpart). Dark Impale is CureShell when [MENTION=7678]ShinkuDragon[/MENTION] wants Dark Knights to have Cura and Shellga.
Other classes like Mercedes were dumbed down even more, imo.
Yes, but Potato is just a Snipe skill that we press every few seconds. It won't keep me awake. I won't need to see how many mobs there are, only press a key every 8 seconds. Angelic Buster, for example, was 'fun' enough to keep me awake thanks to her recharge system. The 'mob count' system that Dark Knights used to have would have done the same thing. Yeah, I don't even know how to have fun. It's all about staying awake.
And Sacrifice is used even less now thanks to all the Dark Impale hyper skills.
Yes, it's so sad that Iron Will is now lost. So sad.
ShinkuDragon Wrote:we didn't want DI! and your ACB destroys impale in every possible way, including range! your 1h weapon has better range than a spear -flips logic-
Not in PDR ignore or OHKO rate possible ways .-. Or the ability to suck.
MetaSeraphim Wrote:I am sorry but no, there was no sacifice made for Dark Impale
I believe he meant Achilles, not the apparent 'dumbing down'.
MetaSeraphim Wrote:there was no dumbing down of Dark Knights for Dark Impale. Before Dark Impale it was "When in doubt, spam Crusher." Fury was only useful in like 1 - 3 situations tops.
I believe it was more "spam Buster of Fury depending on the number of mobs". Sometimes, I certainly was in doubt. How could I tell how many there were in that crowd of mobs? Oh well, there was definitely more than 3I just Fury'd.
MetaSeraphim Wrote:You go to one map that is good for Crusher and you spam it, you go to one map that is good for Fury and you spam it, you go to any map now and spam Dark Impale, guess what, there isn't a difference between the three.
I don't know about you, but I found myself encountering mobs groups of all kinds of sizes when I trained a Dragon Knight. Then came LKC's Under the Castle Walls 1, where there were fewer mobs on the floating platforms (and therefore more Buster, but Fury definitely had more fun before the LKC levels, not to say that Buster had no fun at all), and more mobs on the ground platform (enough for Fury to be used and benefit you). It was like a map designed for Dragon Knights.
MetaSeraphim Wrote:At no point where Dark Knights better than they are now, at no point where they ever dumbed down (Except for the Berserk change but Berserk was retarded in the first place, it would have been better if there was only certain skills you could use while in Berserk mode instead of just improving your overall damage), at no point did Dark Knights take more skill to play than they do now.
Dark Knights were 1000x better than they are now when Iron Will's duration wasn't lowered to 240 seconds. Then they had to add Hyper Body - Persist...
MetaSeraphim Wrote:Dark Knights are the only class in the game that have managed to stay consistently consistent in what they are and what they do.
No one likes Hyper Body anymore, that's for sure. And they really moved away from the dragon theme after Ascension, changing from Dragon Knights with a dark spirit to an actual Dark Knight (reinforced by Dark Thirst and Potato), which would be cool if Demon Slayers and Demon Avengers didn't exist.
Even Wrote:I still dont understand why rush and monster magner are in 4th job for adventurers, all new jobs have them in 2nd &/or 3rd. Just look at ds, a monster magnet skill in 2nd job, a rushing skill in 2nd job, an aoe monster magnet like skill in 3rd job and if that was not enough, a guardian skill in 3rd job along with paladin's version of achilles in 4th job. Makes a lot more sense if they dump rush into 2nd job and monster magnet in 3rd, give all warriors something more useful in 4th job like achilles for hero/drk.
Because there would be too much work in finding out what to replace 60 SP (or 90 SP including Power Stance) worth of skills with. We already have so much spare SP thanks to Tempest. And then you'll also have to find which skills in 2nd and/or 3rd job to replace. Too much work for explorer warriors.
Even Wrote:DS is a very mobile warrior and is tankier than drk's makes no sense at all (no hb does not count when decent hb exist)
No, they both have their ups and downs. Decent Hyper Body cannot be dispelled and is less damaging to your draining ability (unless you need it) and syncs with Iron Will, but it costs more MP, adds less maximum HP and maximum MP (if you need it) and doesn't affect party members.
ShinkuDragon Wrote:arans have drain and achilles, demon slayers have their own drain-y ability along with achilles and a heckuva large resistance, mercedes freaking have achilles, yadda yadda. let's not turn this thread into another "drk want stuff back" thread though, i'm bored of even those by now.
I love 'em.
MetaSeraphim Wrote:Of course that doesn't mean I know more, but I still strongly disagree with the notion that Dark Knights have lost something, besides achilles.
Iron Will's duration. Lost. All 60 seconds. And then there's Dragon Blood's lovely pulse animation. Hex's animation also became a lot more of a rare occurrence, from every 4 seconds to every 100 seconds (unless you cancel the buff, which is troublesome, and even then, it has a 4 second frequency). I'm okay with that though, as there are now more variety/randomness in the symbols appearing.
MetaSeraphim Wrote:Hyper Hyper Body can give twice as much HP and MP as Decent HB, also, Decent HB isn't a party skill.
Don't forget the extra 20 seconds! But really, no one will use hyper Hyper Body. I don't even use normal Hyper Body. Oh, and Iron Will? I don't even have SP in that piece of pomegranate.
Mazz Wrote:As was mine. The reason I quit it was because they lost the main thing making them fun/challenging. Big Bang royally f'ucked them over with more than just ruining Berserk.
I really don't want to have the old Berserk with the state of the game is in right now.
Mazz Wrote:People used to choose either Spear or Pole Arm, and use Buster or Fury depending which weapon they decided to use. If you went with a Spear you'd pretty much only use Buster, aside from Fury to gather large mobs (Gobies/Himes), and if you went with a Pole Arm you'd use Fury and Sacrifice. I loved the idea of one class being able to choose two separate paths.
In my completely personal opinion, that was dumb and I hated the duplicate skills. And you could already choose your path when you advanced from 1st job.
Even Wrote:60% does not mean twice as much hp, especially not with all these equips giving you % hp from before, like dom pendant or chtp. This also means your 4k hp will not turn into 6k hp with hb on, it will be like 1000 hp bonus because you probably have some % hp gear from before that allowed you to achieve 4k hp in the first place.
Doesn't change the fact that 60% (80%) is twice as effective as 40% regardless of other % HP sources.
MetaSeraphim Wrote:You're supporting my view more than anything. Dark Impale is the next step. Crusher is Cura, Fury is Curaga and Dark Impale is Curaja. Once you have Curaja you aren't going to be using the other three because they are useless.
No, he's not. Buster is Cure and Fury is Shell (Fury isn't an improvement over Buster, but its damage to mob count counterpart). Dark Impale is CureShell when [MENTION=7678]ShinkuDragon[/MENTION] wants Dark Knights to have Cura and Shellga.
ShinkuDragon Wrote:do note, i still like my dark knight. i just think it has lost the variety it had and has been dumbed down way too hard.
Other classes like Mercedes were dumbed down even more, imo.
MetaSeraphim Wrote:In the past we had Crusher, Fury, Sacrifice and Dragon Roar. Now we have Dark Impale, Dark Synthesis, Dragon Roar and Sacrifice.
We have the same amount of useable attacks now as we did then. Both Sacrifice and Dragon Roar are still useful during training or bossing.
Yes, but Potato is just a Snipe skill that we press every few seconds. It won't keep me awake. I won't need to see how many mobs there are, only press a key every 8 seconds. Angelic Buster, for example, was 'fun' enough to keep me awake thanks to her recharge system. The 'mob count' system that Dark Knights used to have would have done the same thing. Yeah, I don't even know how to have fun. It's all about staying awake.
And Sacrifice is used even less now thanks to all the Dark Impale hyper skills.
MetaSeraphim Wrote:The only true thing we lost was our defense skill.
Yes, it's so sad that Iron Will is now lost. So sad.