what the fu.ck

Yeah, $150-200 per 18% stat equip is actually not that unlikely if you cube them. It's not the best use of money.

Yeah you got a point. guess I should stop even thinking about cubing again.

Or we can all just wait till nexon screws up every time and get like 10k maplepoints for free

Then wait for sales and get more cubes for free

At least that's what I'm doing cause I have no real time to invest heavily into this game. I play how it was before: play for free, don't give a crap at all the NX laden people. NX is supposed to make your gameplay more FUN not better than everyone else, but Nexon threw that idea out the window a LONG time ago. Now I'm just content with my lol damage and try to do the best that I can within my means (like sticking with my +7 with 60%s reverse equinox with 6% luk and +12 watk)

I bought $20-$50 worth of NX before just cause I could (and perma pets ) But it was money I got as presents from my birthday or christmas. I never really spend excess money because I don't feel I need it. I did splurge on myself a little because I do have a part-time job and I use that as spending money as opposed to my parents' money. It is rewarding to be able to spend your own money how you want it and when you want. It may be sad to see that all this money could have been spent on something even more useful than a 1 time virtual currency (a PS3 and a TV set up could have easily kept you going for the next 5 years), but it really is up to them to buy what they want. It's their money; not ours.

Its not that much - i spent a grand on cubes and shielding wards aussie minimum wage is double the us i guess.


edit: i didnt go into the shop online i dont walk around with a grand in my pocket.

But when i buy them for my guild events the guys/girls always ask what game it is and why people come in and get heaps at a time

edit edit: pineapple that peach.

Yeah, $150-200 per 18% stat equip is actually not that unlikely if you cube them. It's not the best use of money.

i used to cube, after noticing how freaking much it can cost, i stopped, hard, my gloves showed me that (over 150 just to get unique.)

That is a lot of money to spend all at once. But in my ...however many years it's been, (since beta) I've spent well over 3,000 before I started merching through MTS. Was actually really pissed when I world Xfered, and had my entire MTS history wiped. Cause I was quite proud of it.

I think the best part about being done with my gear for the most part, is knowing that I don't have to cube anymore. I am content with spending the occasional 25k nx on more perm NX clothes.

Even though I initially winced too seeing that much money paid for NX, I don't think we can begrudge this person for how they're using their money. Most of us probably won't spend a spare $1,000 on NX but why are we calling this guy out for doing so? I wince too when I hear of people spending hundreds of dollars on booze in clubs, or buying brand name clothes but that's because that's not how I'd choose to spend money either. Those people, or anyone else who spends money on entertainment or non-essentials, aren't any better or worse than the person in the video.

Money is just something we use to get stuff we want or need. Many of us save as much of it as we can, not for its own sake, but because we might want to use it for something later. Money itself doesn't have any more intrinsic value than what we assign it. The person in the video has decided that they want to use $1,000 on a game, then well so be it.

I don't think a good argument to say "ah but the money's spent on a CRAP game", well maybe this person really enjoys the game. Maybe he has heaps of friends on Maple, or he's really invested in his character or he gets a really big kick out of having awesomely potentialed weapons/armour. Or maybe the person's great at MTSing and intends to merchant his way to a healthy profit. Who knows.

Even though I initially winced too seeing that much money paid for NX, I don't think we can begrudge this person for how they're using their money. Most of us probably won't spend a spare $1,000 on NX but why are we calling this guy out for doing so? I wince too when I hear of people spending hundreds of dollars on booze in clubs, or buying brand name clothes but that's because that's not how I'd choose to spend money either. Those people, or anyone else who spends money on entertainment or non-essentials, aren't any better or worse than the person in the video.

Money is just something we use to get stuff we want or need. Many of us save as much of it as we can, not for its own sake, but because we might want to use it for something later. Money itself doesn't have any more intrinsic value than what we assign it. The person in the video has decided that they want to use $1,000 on a game, then well so be it.

I don't think a good argument to say "ah but the money's spent on a CRAP game", well maybe this person really enjoys the game. Maybe he has heaps of friends on Maple, or he's really invested in his character or he gets a really big kick out of having awesomely potentialed weapons/armour. Or maybe the person's great at MTSing and intends to merchant his way to a healthy profit. Who knows.

The thing is, money spent on a "crap" game isn't a good use of money. When you're spending money online, you're expecting your investment in whatever you spent your money on to be secure. As stated numerous times before, Nexon does not do a very good job on security, so there's going to be a giant arrow pointing to him saying "HACK ME NOW", which will inevitably happen. Another thing that was stated before was that when you're giving money to a company doing a very poor job, you're encouraging them to remain the same. So, by spending large amounts of cash on Nexon, you're encouraging them to stay the same; you're encouraging their lack of service, the lack of security, the lack of any care whatsoever on the game.

When we're calling the game "crap" as you put it, we're talking not talking about the entertainment value of the game; we're talking about how good of a job the company in charge of the game does. I don't think you've fully understood this, so I will highly recommend that you go back to and reread the comments in this thread without skimming over.

When we're calling the game "crap" as you put it, we're talking not talking about the entertainment value of the game; we're talking about how good of a job the company in charge of the game does. I don't think you've fully understood this, so I will highly recommend that you go back to and reread the comments in this thread without skimming over.

I have read the comments. What you're suggesting, it seems, is that we should be boycotting the company because it doesn't do a very good job of securing player's accounts plus other game issues. It's a completely fair point to say that the company SHOULD be doing more for its players (especially given how much money it's making) but that doesn't mean that it's necessarily a bad decision on the player's part to pay for it if they want to.

You're saying that you're not talking about the entertainment value of the game, but that is exactly the reason why somone would spend money on it. If there was no entertainment value, and only the problems you describe, I doubt that the person in the video would fork over $1,000 for the game. While I understand the criticisms levied at Nexon, that in themselves doesn't negate the fact that some people find the game fun enough to invest $1,000.00. To dismiss the entertainment value is to ignore the very reason why the money is actually spent in the first place. The counterfactual is, if the person buys no NX, while it might send a message to Nexon, also means a terrible gaming experience for the player who wants to play the game the way they like.

I'm sure many people boycott Nexon on principle because of their shoddy security and their arguably unethical cash shop schemes and that's fine. Some people, like me, hold back on spending NX and would spend more if I knew the game was more secure or if Nexon was less greedy. However, is it so hard to understand that maybe someone (with a spare $1,000) enjoys the game enough to spend $1,000 on it, despite the issues that exist with the game and Nexon?

I have read the comments. What you're suggesting, it seems, is that we should be boycotting the company because it doesn't do a very good job of securing player's accounts plus other game issues. It's a completely fair point to say that the company SHOULD be doing more for its players (especially given how much money it's making) but that doesn't mean that it's necessarily a bad decision on the player's part to pay for it if they want to.

You're saying that you're not talking about the entertainment value of the game, but that is exactly the reason why somone would spend money on it. If there was no entertainment value, and only the problems you describe, I doubt that the person in the video would fork over $1,000 for the game. While I understand the criticisms levied at Nexon, that in themselves doesn't negate the fact that some people find the game fun enough to invest $1,000.00. To dismiss the entertainment value is to ignore the very reason why the money is actually spent in the first place. The counterfactual is, if the person buys no NX, while it might send a message to Nexon, also means a terrible gaming experience for the player who wants to play the game the way they like.

I'm sure many people boycott Nexon on principle because of their shoddy security and their arguably unethical cash shop schemes and that's fine. Some people, like me, hold back on spending NX and would spend more if I knew the game was more secure or if Nexon was less greedy. However, is it so hard to understand that maybe someone (with a spare $1,000) enjoys the game enough to spend $1,000 on it, despite the issues that exist with the game and Nexon?

The topic of if spending money on virtual entertainment is worth it has already been discussed. I don't think you've read any of the arguments at all, as the discussion is currently about spending money on Nexon is a waste since they fail to provide the measures necessary to secure you spending money on the entertainment they provide. I don't know if I'm using the term right, but I do believe the term to describe what you're doing is beating a dead horse.

The topic of if spending money on virtual entertainment is worth it has already been discussed. I don't think you've read any of the arguments at all, as the discussion is currently about spending money on Nexon is a waste since they fail to provide the measures necessary to secure you spending money on the entertainment they provide. I don't know if I'm using the term right, but I do believe the term to describe what you're doing is beating a dead horse.

It's pretty ironic how you continually accuse me of not reading the arguments, when you continue to either misunderstand or refuse to engage what I'm trying to say.

If the discussion is about whether spending money on Nexon is a waste because they fail to secure the game, then in order to discuss it, we can consider the arguments for and against such proposition, yes? What I'm saying is that it is not necessarily a waste of money because, despite Nexon's failure to secure the game as we'd like, there is still value to their games for reasons I have already mentioned. What I was trying to say is that spending money on Nexon for the game's entertainment value cannot be dismissed in considering whether it's a waste of money to spend money on Nexon, even if the game's not very secure. I'm just pointing out it's a cost-benefit analysis that we all do.

If what you mean by "discussion" is for people to just agree with what you're saying, i.e. for people to pat each other the back and murmur that "the game is quite bad, it's just a waste of money", "yes yes, quite right my good fellow" then, IMHO, that's not really a discussion.

It's pretty ironic how you continually accuse me of not reading the arguments, when you continue to either misunderstand or refuse to engage what I'm trying to say.

If the discussion is about whether spending money on Nexon is a waste because they fail to secure the game, then in order to discuss it, we can consider the arguments for and against such proposition, yes? What I'm saying is that it is not necessarily a waste of money because, despite Nexon's failure to secure the game as we'd like, there is still value to their games for reasons I have already mentioned. What I was trying to say is that spending money on Nexon for the game's entertainment value cannot be dismissed in considering whether it's a waste of money to spend money on Nexon, even if the game's not very secure. I'm just pointing out it's a cost-benefit analysis that we all do.

If what you mean by "discussion" is for people to just agree with what you're saying, i.e. for people to pat each other the back and murmur that "the game is quite bad, it's just a waste of money", "yes yes, quite right my good fellow" then, IMHO, that's not really a discussion.

While spending money on Nexon does have its entertainment values, you fail to understand how poor of a job they do to secure the game. When you purchase something, you're expecting to get full value out of it. But this is not the case with Nexon. Since they fail to enhance the security of their games in any way whatsoever, by spending a large quantity of money, you're putting a "Hey, hack me now!" sign over your head for the hackers. And these hackers will succeed in obtaining your account information, and take whatever entertainment value you hope to get out from giving money to them for themselves. When you're spending money on online games for entertainment, you're not expecting the entertainment that you've rightfully purchased to go to the people that want to steal it off of you, you're expecting the entertainment to go to yourself and whoever else you want it to go to.

Think of Nexon as a jewelry shop (because jewelry is something people will steal), and their inability to secure the game as them setting up their shop in the middle of a ghetto with an extremely high crime rate; they care enough to secure the money you've spent, but they don't care enough about what happens to the item after you bought it from them. Now, for the sake of argument, let's say that they are legally allowed to set up this shop in the ghetto. When you walk out of the jewelry shop, guess what happens? You get robbed, and all value you hope to get from the jewelry is gone. You complain to the shop, but what do they care? They have your money, and that's all they need. Now, if people keep buying from this shop over and over again, and they get robbed over and over again, and they complain and do nothing else, the shop still won't care. They don't give a damn about you expecting to get whatever value you expect to get, they only care about the money. And when people do this over and over again, do you think that the shop will care? No, they have their money, why should they care about you when they know other people will buy their jewelry. Why should they care about you, the consumer expecting to get value off of their products, when you're throwing money at them? Their business model is successful and takes little effort to maintain, and when someone decides to throw a large amount of money at them, do you think they'll use this money to improve their business? Of course not, as using money to improve their business is frankly a waste of cash, and there's much better things to do with that cash, like buying a private jet. And what's even better is that the majority of their customers aren't the sharpest tools in the shed, so they know that their customers will continue throw money at them while doing little to nothing to have them change their business model into something where the customer gets entertainment equal to or greater than the money they spent. Get it?

When you're giving money to Nexon, you are encouraging them to maintain this behavior; you are encouraging them to not improve themselves, you are encouraging them to continue putting giant "HEY I SPENT MONEY ON THIS GAME, HACKERS TAKE EVERYTHING I HAVE SO THAT ALL ENTERTAINMENT VALUE I HOPE TO GET FROM THIS GAME WILL GO TO YOU GUYS. YEAHHHHHHH" sign on your forehead in big, bold, red letters. You say that there's merit in getting entertainment from Nexon after spending money on them, but what you fail to realize is that the entertainment value you expect to get will go to OTHER people that will steal from you in a heartbeat. Not you. If they actually did a great job maintaining their game's security while doing poorly on everything else, your argument would be valid. But when other people will steal the entertainment that you've bought and that you're expecting to get, well then, something's seriously wrong. If you still think that getting entertainment from a company that doesn't give a damn about what happens after your purchase is worth it, well then, keep telling yourself that. When people continue to purchase entertainment from Nexon, especially when they throw large amounts of money at them consistently, you are encouraging them to keep doing what they're doing. And looking at Nexon's general consumer population, I don't think they'll realize that they're supporting incompetency and that whatever entertainment they expect from giving money to Nexon will go to the people that choose to exploit the company's security flaws for their own personal benefit.

The only entertainment value you get from throwing money as Nexon is the entertainment value of the people that hack you in order to obtain whatever entertainment the hacked person expected to obtain get, and that is that.

EDIT: While you can say that you can entertainment value from meeting/talking to the people in the game, that doesn't require money. You don't need money for this, and anyone that you've met that requires something that signifies that you've spent money on the game in order to have a social interaction with them isn't someone worth talking to.

I'm pretty sure people aren't thinking about supporting Nexon when buying NX. They're considering what they'll be able to purchase in the Cash Shop. Suggesting that they not do so is misguided as they're not interested in the implications of their action. They're in it for instant satisfaction.

You can claim that they're wasting their money on something frivolous but you do the same when you buy ice cream. Their purchase might be exponentially larger than yours but you are not their financial adviser.

I'm pretty sure people aren't thinking about supporting Nexon when buying NX. They're considering what they'll be able to purchase in the Cash Shop. Suggesting that they not do so is misguided as they're not interested in the implications of their action. They're in it for instant satisfaction.

You can claim that they're wasting their money on something frivolous but you do the same when you buy ice cream. Their purchase might be exponentially larger than yours but you are not their financial adviser.

1. Exactly; they aren't thinking about it. They have no idea that they're supporting the incompetency of the company they're buying from, and should take that into consideration. If they want to get the most out of their money, why not do something when the company you're spending on isn't giving you a product of satisfactory quality.
2. I agree with your point on instant satisfaction. If they know they're going to get the joy of being able to purchase items from the cash shop, then they'll get that. There's no way any company can mess that up.
3. Ice cream vendors don't mess up your ice cream most of the time.
4. I never said I wanted to force everyone to follow my opinion. When you criticize someone, do they have to accept your criticism? No, they do not.

I have to give my lunch money to the school bully every day or he'll beat me up. I think this is a sound investment, as not getting beat up is great, and doing things while not getting knuckle sandwich'd is great. My brother keeps telling me that I should take a stand against him and that I'm wasting money that could be going to something worthwhile, like food, but what does he know? He's not the boss of me.

1. Exactly; they aren't thinking about it. They have no idea that they're supporting the incompetency of the company they're buying from, and should take that into consideration. If they want to get the most out of their money, why not do something when the company you're spending on isn't giving you a product of satisfactory quality.

What criteria defines a satisfactory product, to you? If you were to ask the average Mapler if they were happy to play Maple Story, they would say yes. Maybe they don't know as much about the inner workings of the company as you do but these are the people the game is tailored to please.

2. I agree with your point on instant satisfaction. If they know they're going to get the joy of being able to purchase items from the cash shop, then they'll get that. There's no way any company can mess that up.
3. Ice cream vendors don't mess up your ice cream most of the time.

Again, this is concerning NX Cash and not the entire game.

4. I never said I wanted to force everyone to follow my opinion. When you criticize someone, do they have to accept your criticism? No, they do not.

I was replying to pretty much everyone in this thread, actually. That's why I didn't quote you.

I have to give my lunch money to the school bully every day or he'll beat me up. I think this is a sound investment, as not getting beat up is great, and doing things while not getting knuckle sandwich'd is great. My brother keeps telling me that I should take a stand against him and that I'm wasting money that could be going to something worthwhile, like food, but what does he know? He's not the boss of me.

If your intentions were something akin to brotherly love, that'd be awesome. I don't think many of the other users would share this compassion. They aren't trying to help anyone else with their criticism. They're offended that others support something they're against. This is fine and this is human nature. We get angry and wonder why everyone else isn't as angry as we are.

I'm not using this as a point of debate, either. I just don't think your Aesop applies here.

I felt that you were addressing the thread in general, but I just felt that it would be a safer assumption to think that you were addressing me. Eh, my bad.

Anyways, what a defines a satisfactory product is one that the consumer is guaranteed to get, guaranteed to last for however long their hearts desire (up to them for being reasonable on this), and guaranteed to not be stolen due to a fault on the company's behalf. I don't actually get beat up by a school bully; I just used that metaphor for the sake of showing that people don't need to follow criticism, no matter how objective it is, and that not following sound criticism is stupid. I'm sure people can agree with the "offended for supporting something they're against" part.

@Imagine Look, those are all very understandable reasons why YOU don't buy NX (I assume). I'm sure there are many out there who also boycott Nexon on principle because of problems with the game. That's fine. But you have to understand that it's a cost/benefit analysis for everyone, and not everyone would come to the conclusion you do. Most people DON'T get hacked. The chances of getting hacked is not 100% or anything near that rate. If someone wants to play Maplestory they will weigh up whether it's worth paying for cash shop items to get better game play and risk getting hacked and losing a monetary (and time) investment in the game.

I hope you do understand that you CAN take into account the incompetency of Nexon AND still want to pay to enhance gameplay. As I said, it's a cost/benefit analysis that everyone does, and everyone comes to their own conclusions. As far as we know, this guy decided to spend $1000 on the game while fully knowing that his account(s) may get hacked. However, this risk doesn't outweigh how much more fun he can have with the game with cash items. For many others, like me, we hold back on spending NX because despite the existing risk of being hacked, we still want to enjoy the game with extra, paid features.

Clearly for many, Maplestory is by no means perfect, or even very good. But it's GOOD ENOUGH for many to want to spend money on it.

It's a completely fair point to say that the company SHOULD be doing more for its players (especially given how much money it's making) but that doesn't mean that it's necessarily a bad decision on the player's part to pay for it if they want to.

I can't argue perspectives but I can argue that it is an awful decision, not only to the player doing it, but the rest of us who play it. It is a fact that nexon's security is subpar and it is a fact nexon's compensation are so distant from the damages that it's more of face value effort. I understand your point, however, the scenario is quite clear in this circumstance that this minor probably didn't weigh the options.

@Imagine Look, those are all very understandable reasons why YOU don't buy NX (I assume). I'm sure there are many out there who also boycott Nexon on principle because of problems with the game. That's fine. But you have to understand that it's a cost/benefit analysis for everyone, and not everyone would come to the conclusion you do. Most people DON'T get hacked. The chances of getting hacked is not 100% or anything near that rate. If someone wants to play Maplestory they will weigh up whether it's worth paying for cash shop items to get better game play and risk getting hacked and losing a monetary (and time) investment in the game.

I hope you do understand that you CAN take into account the incompetency of Nexon AND still want to pay to enhance gameplay. As I said, it's a cost/benefit analysis that everyone does, and everyone comes to their own conclusions. As far as we know, this guy decided to spend $1000 on the game while fully knowing that his account(s) may get hacked. However, this risk doesn't outweigh how much more fun he can have with the game with cash items. For many others, like me, we hold back on spending NX because despite the existing risk of being hacked, we still want to enjoy the game with extra, paid features.

Clearly for many, Maplestory is by no means perfect, or even very good. But it's GOOD ENOUGH for many to want to spend money on it.

I don't think you've fully grasped my metaphor.
The reason most people don't get hacked is because they have nothing of value. Why steal from someone with a couple of pennies when you can rob the guy sporting a new 10K gold chain? I completely understand that you can have your fun with spending of NX, but as I have stated beforehand, this will encourage Nexon to not change. Another flaw of your argument is that you're basing it solely on the people who spend NX to buy new clothes (which does not compose the entire population) What about the other people spending money on the NX, the ones that upgrade their gear constantly in order to take on the challenge of bossing (you can argue that there is no challenge in bossing nowadays, but for the sake of the argument, stick to this topic), the ones that use the MTS to buy 10 atk wgs to sell off, the ones that use gachapon in hopes of the feeling of getting a rare item? Guess what happens to them when all the cash they've spend on this goes down the toilet because Nexon screwed up? They start over, and I don't think they'll take kind to the fact that all entertainment/potential entertainment goes to someone else. And if even if they don't get hacked, when they trying to do something fun or building up to that thing, say bossing, there's a good chance that they'll run into others that believe that the game caters to their selfish intentions. Guess what happens now? Kill stealing, and if they're lucky enough, a good old DC lock that everyone can enjoy.

As stated before, I can see your point. I understand that people can have their fun with buying NX, but when taking Nexon into full consideration, whatever fun they have is subject to hackers and is harmful to everyone out there who has suffered from Nexon's incompetency: the ones who are wrongfully banned, the ones who are DC locked, the ones who hope to take on the challenge of fighting Maplestory's hardest bosses, the ones who are constantly being KS'd, the ones who are harassed every single day, the ones who are unable to obtain a good FM spot because they refuse to side with the major merchanting guilds, etc. These are the people who suffer from Nexon's incompetency, and throwing money at Nexon will only encourage them to maintain this environment.

We all agree that when you buy NX, you expect entertainment, no matter if it's cubes, clothes, etc. But this act is extremely selfish, no matter if the person realizes this or doesn't. You are disregarding the mistreatment of the company towards others in order for your own personal benefit. Now, I may know all the words in the English dictionary, but a blatant disregard towards others for personal benefit is the textbook definition of selfish. The cost/benefit when considering the ENTIRE system will look like this (not just the person buying NX and Nexon, but everyone:
benefit
COST
This is probably is an over exaggeration, but the point I want to bring upon is this: the benefits towards the entire population of Nexon's consumer base is heavily outweighed by the detrimental it affects on the same population. While the buyer will receive at least some form of entertainment, everyone else will suffer. Buying NX encourages this behavior, and the buyer knowing this or not still doesn't matter: the buyer is indirectly maintaining the suffering of a large portion of the player population. Doing something selfish whether you acknowledge it or not has not effect on the severity of the action committed. There is nothing good with buying NX, and doing so will harm everyone as a whole. Every person of the consumer population is connected, and disregarding this connection when one is dealing with a company such a Nexon, will only harm everyone in the end, thus the costs far outweigh the benefits here.

Is this thread really happening?

Is this thread really happening?

This. It's like we're reading the same commentary/debate/venting here regarding this game's microtransaction economy that we have for the past half decade.

Oh wait....