Black and White recent happenings thread!

try a scizor or ferrothorn, their bulkiness is practically an abomination

Is bullet punch Scizor still as broken as it was in Platinum?

Negative. Ferrothorn basically eats Scizor for breakfast.

Well...I'm slow. Apparently Hypnosis got nerfed back to 60 accuracy down from 70 during the transition from 4th gen. Guess I'll teach my Gengar Psychic, 60 accuracy is too unreliable for battle subway, or anything really x_x

Negative. Ferrothorn basically eats Scizor for breakfast.

I've never had a Ferrothorn give my Scizor trouble unless I had horrible luck with paralysis from t-wave. You just don't want to run Bullet Punch on Scizor or you'll be walled like no tomorrow.

Use moves like: X-Scissor/Bug Bite, Roost/Morning Sun, swords dance and you will run through Ferrothorn pretty easily. Just have to deal with possible paralysis. Have a Heal Bell carrier on your team and you're fine. But, after 2-3 swords dances Scizor is pretty much able to shut down anything else in the opposing party, especially if he gets an agility up while the Ferrothorn stays in(and most do stay in and try to leech seed and paralyze you for 2-3+ turns).

Can pokemon inbreed? I forgot if the game was coded to not allow that...

If they can, then mega facepalm for me, because I've been making breeding harder than it needs to be.

Can pokemon inbreed? I forgot if the game was coded to not allow that...

If they can, then mega facepalm for me, because I've been making breeding harder than it needs to be.

What do you mean by inbreed?

Breed two pokemon, then proceed to breed the hatchling with one of the parents. I thought I remembered that not working for some reason.

Breed two pokemon, then proceed to breed the hatchling with one of the parents. I thought I remembered that not working for some reason.

IIRC, it didn't work in Gen 2. But yes, you can.

I've never had a Ferrothorn give my Scizor trouble unless I had horrible luck with paralysis from t-wave. You just don't want to run Bullet Punch on Scizor or you'll be walled like no tomorrow.

Use moves like: X-Scissor/Bug Bite, Roost/Morning Sun, swords dance and you will run through Ferrothorn pretty easily. Just have to deal with possible paralysis. Have a Heal Bell carrier on your team and you're fine. But, after 2-3 swords dances Scizor is pretty much able to shut down anything else in the opposing party, especially if he gets an agility up while the Ferrothorn stays in(and most do stay in and try to leech seed and paralyze you for 2-3+ turns).

There's really no point in running Scizor if you don't run Bullet Punch :3. And even if you do manage to get past Ferrothorn's Leech Seed + Paralysis + Protect combo, which is still really hard due to none of your attacks being super effective (except, say, Brick Break), it's easily revenged. If you do take the time to set up Agility, I'm pretty sure it can stall you out if used by a good user.

There's really no point in running Scizor if you don't run Bullet Punch :3. And even if you do manage to get past Ferrothorn's Leech Seed + Paralysis + Protect combo, which is still really hard due to none of your attacks being super effective (except, say, Brick Break), it's easily revenged. If you do take the time to set up Agility, I'm pretty sure it can stall you out if used by a good user.

Mm, I dunno. Most of the competetive Ferrothorns I've faced got OHKO'd by a single Bug Bite after 3 swords dances. 2 swords dances should 2 HKO Ferrothorn. I run Adamant Scizor with Bug Bite, Morning Sun, Swords Dance, and Agility with the held item leftovers. Ferrothorn has no way to faint Scizor if all it relies on is power whip, leech seed, or paralysis. The threats would be a fire type move after Ferrothorn is fainted or switched, or a fast special sweeper. If Scizor is not paralyzed he will sweep the opposing team if he opted to use 2 swords dances and 1 agility at the very least. Heck, 2 swords dances OHKO's a Blissey. If you're scared about being revenged killed, then switch it out and use heal bell to save it from being paralyzed. Or Morning Sun/Roost the damage received from Ferrothorn and he can't be revenge killed unless by some fire move.

Obviously, there are different situations you'll be in and nothing is ideal. However, usually this Scizor will win every time against a Ferrothorn, but it can be easily wiped out or forced to switch if there is a fire move or special sweeper threatening it. If you have the sun out, Morning Sun heals 3/4 of the hp and lowers the special att for opposing water moves. The other option is Roost. Roost heals half, which is pretty decent too. It's pretty effective for Scizor's survivability I'd say :/

Bullet Punch cannot be on this set. You need a hard hitting bug move. Both agility and swords dance are a must if you are planning on sweeping and out-speeding threats with Scizor, before or after Ferrothorn comes out. You also must have a healing move to go with leftovers, or Scizor will not be around long enough to win against stalling Pokemon.

Everything you need to know about b/w breeding



You should only breed sons/daughters if you're trying to IV breed it. Get the power item and hope some other 31 IVs pass down and the randomized ones are also 31.

Btw, does anyone here actually have a team of 6 that are level 100? I kinda wanna battle some people when I get my last few guys to 100. I really wish they had auto-level for 100 wifi battles like before, or at the very least let people do 6v6 for level 50 auto-level instead of 3v3 and you choose your 3 based on what 6 you see your opponent having. The vast majority of people with 100s are either emulator or pokesav'd

Mm, I dunno. Most of the competetive Ferrothorns I've faced got OHKO'd by a single Bug Bite after 3 swords dances. 2 swords dances should 2 HKO Ferrothorn. I run Adamant Scizor with Bug Bite, Morning Sun, Swords Dance, and Agility. The threats would be a fire type move after Ferrothorn, or a fast special sweeper. If Scizor is not paralyzed he will sweep the opposing team if he opted to use 2 swords dances and 1 agility at the very least. Heck 2 swords dances OHKO's a Blissey. If you're scared about being revenged killed, then switch it out and use heal bell to save it from being paralyzed. Or Morning Sun/Roost the damage received from Ferrothorn and he can't be revenge killed unless by some fire move.

Obviously there are different situations you'll be in and nothing is ideal. However, usually this Scizor will win every time against a Ferrothorn, but it can be easily wiped out or forced to switch if there is a fire move or special sweeper threatening it. If you have the sun out, Morning Sun heals 3/4 of the hp and lowers the special att for opposing water moves. The other option is Roost. Roost heals half, which is pretty decent too. It's pretty effective for Scizor's survivability I'd say :/

To be honest, Scizor probably 2hkos or 1hkos everything after 2 Swords Dance, but Ferrothorn should theoretically win.

Turn of Events

Scizor uses Swords Dance!
Ferrothorn uses Leech Seed! (Scizor has 7/8 hp).

Scizor uses Swords Dance!
Ferrothorn uses Thunder Wave! (Scizor has 6/8 hp).

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses Protect! (Scizor has 5/8 hp).

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses *Insert Move of choice Here* (Scizor has 3.5/8 hp, Ferrothorn has 1/2 hp)

Scizor is paralyzed!
Ferrothorn uses Protect! It failed! (Scizor has 2.5/8 hp, Ferrothorn has 5/8 hp)

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses Protect (100% works, and Scizor has 1.5/8 hp, Ferrothorn has 6/8 hp)

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses *Insert Move of choice.* Ferrothorn has 3.5/8 hp, Scizor is dead.

Keep in mind this is without leftovers, and with leftovers it would mean that Ferrothorn would have 5.5/8 hp in the end and I was pretty generous to the fact paralysis only struck once. If you try to to set up more Scizor may be even more screwed (or lucky, perhaps).

Heck, I didn't even factor in Ferrothorn's Iron Barbs.

To be honest, Scizor probably 2hkos or 1hkos everything after 2 Swords Dance, but Ferrothorn should theoretically win.

Turn of Events

Scizor uses Swords Dance!
Ferrothorn uses Leech Seed! (Scizor has 7/8 hp).

Scizor uses Swords Dance!
Ferrothorn uses Thunder Wave! (Scizor has 6/8 hp).

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses Protect! (Scizor has 5/8 hp).

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses *Insert Move of choice Here* (Scizor has 3.5/8 hp, Ferrothorn has 1/2 hp)

Scizor is paralyzed!
Ferrothorn uses Protect! It failed! (Scizor has 2.5/8 hp, Ferrothorn has 5/8 hp)

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses Protect (100% works, and Scizor has 1.5/8 hp, Ferrothorn has 6/8 hp)

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses *Insert Move of choice.* Ferrothorn has 3.5/8 hp, Scizor is dead.

Keep in mind this is without leftovers, and with leftovers it would mean that Ferrothorn would have 5.5/8 hp in the end and I was pretty generous to the fact paralysis only struck once. If you try to to set up more Scizor may be even more screwed (or lucky, perhaps).

Heck, I didn't even factor in Ferrothorn's Iron Barbs.

Where is Roost or Morning Sun? I included that in my strategy against Ferrothorn...xD Obviously, without Morning Sun or Roost, Scizor will lose.

The thing is, your moveset, while it may be able to defeat Ferrothorn after several long, stally, turns, will struggle against a lot of other Pokemon, unless you manage to get +6 in attack and speed >_<.

But if you insist, I'll throw in Iron Barbs and Leftovers and Roost

Scizor uses Swords Dance!
Ferrothorn uses Leech Seed! (Scizor has 7/8 hp).

Scizor uses Swords Dance!
Ferrothorn uses Thunder Wave! (Scizor has 6/8 hp).

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses Protect! (Scizor has 5/8 hp).

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses *Insert Move of choice Here* (Scizor has 5/16 hp, Ferrothorn has 9/16 hp)

Scizor is paralyzed!
Ferrothorn uses Protect! It failed! (Scizor has 3/16 hp, Ferrothorn has 10/16 hp)

Scizor uses Roost!
Ferrothorn uses Protect! It failed! (Scizor has 11/16 hp, Ferrothorn has 11/16 hp)

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses Protect! (Scizor has 9/16 hp, Ferrothorn has 12/16 hp)

Scizor is paralyzed!
Ferrothorn uses *Move of Choice* (Scizor has 6/16 hp, Ferrothorn has 15/16 hp)

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses Protect (Scizor has 4/16 hp, Ferrothorn has....16/16 hp)

Scizor uses Roost!
Ferrothorn uses *Move of Choice* (Scizor has 11/16, Ferro has 16/16)

Scizor uses Bug Bite!
Ferrothorn uses Protect! (Scizor has 9/16, Ferro 16/16)

and so on.

Your best bet is trying to get to +6 without any Parahax.

That's an ideal situation for the Ferrothorn. I have definitely been through this situation at one point, and I could tell I would faint if I did not Roost early enough. I anticipate that I may be unable to attack for at least 2 turns in a row because of paralysis. So, I use Roost right after I finish getting 2 or 3 Swords Dances up. Then I either get my final Swords Dance up or sweep. I would go for +6 as early as possible. The +4 from Swords Dance was just if the situation would seem to be in my favor and it would not have iron barbs. However, any smart player knows that Ferrothorn has protect and you're better off recovering your hp instead of attacking right after you get your Swords Dances up at that point. Thus, in many cases the Ferrothorn will use Protect while you heal yourself. There is no rush to kill Ferrothorn asap. You heal and hit it when you are confident you will survive.

It's somewhat not possible to predict the battle situation entirely because you could be incredibly lucky and not be really affected by paralysis. Or, you could be very unlucky and never get a single attack in against the Ferrothorn. It's just how the player adapts to being paralyzed and whether they realize they need to heal at the right points or not. You should always consider at the minimum that you'll be paralyzed for two turns in a row. Also, leech seed can be avoided as well. This gives the Scizor a free turn if that happens. I always heal at the right points, so I never have a problem with it. Maybe new players would. *shrugs*

Okay, I'll admit that might've been a bit in favor of the Ferrothorn, but honestly, if someone figures out that you don't have Bullet Punch (which is not that hard) they're eventually safely switch in a Pokemon who outspeeds and 1hkos Scizor (or if they're really good, they'll predict the Pokemon you will switch into).

Okay, I'll admit that might've been a bit in favor of the Ferrothorn, but honestly, if someone figures out that you don't have Bullet Punch (which is not that hard) they're eventually safely switch in a Pokemon who outspeeds and 1hkos Scizor (or if they're really good, they'll predict the Pokemon you will switch into).

That is correct. The scizor may have +6 from swords dance and OHKO the new pokemon they bring in if I am using an attack that same turn. Most Pokemon will be OHKO'd though if I do not suffer being paralyzed that turn. That's an ideal situation for me though, so at the very least I'll get 1 KO at the cost of my Scizor being paralyzed in many cases. Then Scizor will faint against the next opposing Pokemon. However, I only use Scizor if I am sure I have killed their fire types or any Pokemon I know that's a threat anyways. I would never bother setting up if I knew they had a fire type Pokemon they could switch to from Ferrothorn. That's just a waste.

Point taken though. I could let the Scizor die, keep it in if it's not paralyzed, or switch it out as well like the opponent does with their Ferrothorn, because I do carry Heal Bell in my party and usually value my Scizor. *shrugs* It all depends on the situation. But, if he's almost fainted and paralyzed, I'll most likely let him faint. As I said above though, there is no use setting up if you know they have a fire type or a huge threat waiting for you though. Team preview let's you know lol.

It's not exactly hard to predict the turn that you'll Swords Dance/Agility/Roost so they can bring in their Pokemon for free.

I guess I'm just...stunned/flabbergasted you're using a Scizor with only 1 attacking move, and there's not even a Baton Pass in there to boot. In the ideal ideal situation, someone would immediately switch Ferrothorn out as soon as you Swords Dance, as they'll be scared that you have Brick Break or something to destroy Ferrothorn. When I say Ferrothorn eats Scizor from breakfast (that's what started this arguement), I meant like, most Scizors. Not Scizors that rely on sheer setup and stalling to kill Ferrothorn. I mean either the Choice Band set (bar a fighting move) and the standard Swords Dance set (Roost/Swords Dance/Bullet Punch/Bug Bite).

It's not exactly hard to predict the turn that you'll Swords Dance/Agility/Roost so they can bring in their Pokemon for free.

I guess I'm just...stunned/flabbergasted you're using a Scizor with only 1 attacking move, and there's not even a Baton Pass in there to boot. In the ideal ideal situation, someone would immediately switch Ferrothorn out as soon as you Swords Dance, as they'll be scared that you have Brick Break or something to destroy Ferrothorn. When I say Ferrothorn eats Scizor from breakfast (that's what started this arguement), I meant like, most Scizors. Not Scizors that rely on sheer setup and stalling to kill Ferrothorn. I mean either the Choice Band set (bar a fighting move) and the standard Swords Dance set (Roost/Swords Dance/Bullet Punch/Bug Bite).

That's understandable. I just thought you meant Scizor in general initially. I use Scizor for late game anyways rather than early on. I used to run Bug Bite, Swords Dance, Agility, and Baton Pass. I couldn't fit Roost/Morning Sun on that set anywhere, because if I did I would lose speed or attack from setting up depending on which move I sacrificed. I soon found that I was doing well, but my Scizor had horrible survivability without a recovery move. Thus, I decided to change it up. Sorry for the argument though.

ev training my future chandelure (replacing jellicent on my subway singles team)
modest & flash fire // 26/29/31/12/31/31
evs: 0/0/252/0/254/4
moveset:
overheat
protect*
will-o-wisp
haze

his position is support for ferrothorn -- immunities to ferrothorns weaknesses for easy stalling of pokemon ferrothorn cant straight up maul the pomegranate out of
i havent decided whether i want protect or not, his purpose is to be immune to the multitude of fire/fighting moves thrown at ferrothorn, phase resters who tend to give ferrothorn problems with defense stacking, and land burns on fighting types. his secondary purpose is hit and run nuking on fire weaks (read: other grass / [steel/poison] who cant be hit by either leech seed or toxic), he isnt really meant to stay in battle for extended time like ferrothorn (hence the lack of special attack evs and bad iv... overheat should destroy anything its used on anyways)

my lead is choice scarfed haxorus, just to speed some battles up (outrage, earthquake, rockslide, brick break) (only 2 pokemon are faster -- scarf manectric, scarf entei). he 1hkos anything not bulky OR 4x weak to a move OR almost all dragons (haban berry ), and can take care of pesky fire leads.

my current team is haxorus, ferrothorn, jellicent
jellicent serves the same purposes as the new chandelure does, but i think the fire typing will do it better. i often find myself just scalding enemies trying to land a burn, and switching every turn just to abuse immunities / extreme resistances. but jellicents water immunity is practically useless, because ferrothorn doesnt pull water moves often and i dont need to switch to avoid them anyways.

sooooo... anyone got item suggestions for chandelure? scarf and leftovers are out. red card is crap, i tried it out on jellicent for a while and its terrible. brightpowder (which is what jellicent has now) is better. jellicent gets some pretty good hax going on with it. options... choice specs or life orb could be ok, brightpowder hax, focus sash, focus band (idk...), rocky helmet (idk...), absorb bulb (dislike), .... i can get pretty much anything, even any 48bp item (hell, 5 of those), and i dont mind buying them if i dont have them.

does focus sash live through sheer cold/fissure/guillotine?