Global MapleStory Tespia: Now Closed (Big Bang inside)

A little update.

[11.22] Tespia has been extended! Tespia will now remain open until Wednesday Nov. 24th at Noon PST.

:3

Well, that's never bad news. Good stuff, nexon.

Nexon: surprise, surprise!

Good job on Tespia extension+windows compatibility.

Maybe they'll roll out another client for Tespia, if the scheduled update tonight does fix the issues.

I think you sorta get what I am talking about.

Let me make this clear-er.
WHEN I SAY BIG BANG, I SERIOUSLY MEAN ALL 3 OF THEM, BIG CHANGE, RESISTANCE, MECHANIC

But I heard that the entire Big Bang Update (this includes all 3) were only 1 of the big updates.

So would the latest update (The Restructering) be the 2nd big update? Which would mean that The Restructering should have something to do with the Black Magician. Right?

you heard wrong the big bang does not include all 3. The big bang is all the changes mob, formula, skills, and etc. The second big patch was the resistance and the third was mechanic.

The restructuring patch is not the 2nd big update for it already happened. The restructuring patch is just a patch where they wanted tied some loose ends because they probably did not have the time to during the big bang patch. So no the restructuring patch has nothing new to do with the black magician.

So no the restructuring patch has nothing new to do with the black magician.

Prove it.

you heard wrong the big bang does not include all 3. The big bang is all the changes mob, formula, skills, and etc. The second big patch was the resistance and the third was mechanic.

The restructuring patch is not the 2nd big update for it already happened. The restructuring patch is just a patch where they wanted tied some loose ends because they probably did not have the time to during the big bang patch. So no the restructuring patch has nothing new to do with the black magician.

?? Big Bang was referring to Class overhaul + Resistance. It was always advertised to be in 3 parts.

If you say the 50% reduction of power guard is useless. What about the reduction brought by achilles or shield mastery? They reduce way less than 50% so they are the ones you would be leaving unmaxed instead.

Point is, power guard is one of the highest damage reducing skills you've got. If you are getting hit 1 with or without it you'd rather take points off:
1) A skill that increases your defense less
2) a skill from 4th job since those points are more useful (can use on any job and 4th job is generally harder to choose what to max)

Achilles works on all damage, very notably 1/1 skills. It isn't exactly a priority either.

Shield mastery effects both physical and magical damage. And i'd rather double (oops, TRIPLE) the entirety of my defense than reduce whatever low amount of damage i may be taking ( just from touch damage mind you) to be even lower.

Lets mention guardian while we're at it. Oh wait, it reduces the effects of power guard by a blindingly obvious 42%. Oh yeah, shield mastery makes it less effective by half (not half but too complicated for me to bother being mathematically correct here) of that 42% too. Unless they change how power guard works, it's reduction comes last and basically by default is worse and lower priority than the skills you compared it to (from different jobs, rendering the comparison essentially useless). Oops, no one mentioned threaten, also obviously better than power guard while also making powerguard less useful. Stacking multiple types of mitigation is inefficient. Making a unique type of mitigation apply (last) to a type of damage that is the most easily avoided type is even more inefficient.

Please note, i'm not now or ever advocating people not get or not use the skill. I originally just casually mentioned that i thought it should be removed from paladins and heroes both for skills that were either
a. more useful or b. unique (c. both would be cool). Use it all you want. personally i might not even put it on my keyboard after a certain point. What surprises me though, is the amount of people telling me what a good skill it is. Either they don't understand this entire discussion is taking place with a post-bb mindset, or they really think it is truly reducing damage in a realistic in-game scenario by 50%.

Please note, i'm not now or ever advocating people not get or not use the skill i originally just casually mentioned that i thought it should be removed from paladins and heroes both for skills that were either
a. more useful or b. unique (c. both would be cool). Use it all you want. personally i might not. What suprises me though, is the amount of people telling me what a good skill it is. Either they don't understand this entire discussion is taking place with a post-bb mindset. or they really think it is truly reducing damage by 50%.

wut.

 Spoiler

How Mob Damage Works

Relevant Calculator:
Mob Damage Calculator

Relevant Formulas:
WDEF = STR * 1.2 + (DEX + LUK) * 0.5 + INT * 0.4
MDEF = STR * 0.4 + (DEX + LUK) * 0.5 + INT * 1.2
Maximum Character Defense = 30,000
Maximum Mob Attack = 29,999
Maximum Character HP = 99,999
As a rule of thumb, your defense needs to be four times the enemy's attack value in order to receive 1 damage from the enemy's attack.
Having 30,000 defense will reduce all damage by about 86%. The "never receive damage" defense number is 40,000 (Because sqrt(WDEF * 0.25) of 40,000 is 100% in the formula), though it's impossible to reach it.
The enemy's attack value is the damage he will do if you have 0 Defense.
Flat damage reduction will only happen on values 8660 and less (and even then at only absurdly high defense values). Values higher than this are always percentage based damage reduction.
The overall procedure is: Get Mob Attack --> Reduce mob attack by threaten --> Calculate & randomize mob attack --> reduce attack by defense --> reduce attack by other means (Achilles, Combo Barrier, etc.) --> reduce damage by Meso Guard.
For every level you are below the enemy, you effectively lose 16 defense or 2.0% of the enemy's damage.
Threaten does not work on Pink Bean or any of his cohorts.

Procedure:
Calculate the following: PDDRounded = Total WDEF * 0.25 <---- Round this to the nearest whole number
Calculate the following: PDDPercentage = Square Root(Total WDEF * 0.25) <--- Round Down
If your level is less than the mob's level, subtract 4 from PDDRounded for every level. If PDDRounded becomes less than 0 because of this, set PDDRounded to 0.
If your level is less than the mob's level, subtract 2.0 from PDDPercentage for every level. If PDDPercentage becomes less than 0 because of this, set PDDPercentage to 0.
Calculate the following: MobDamagePDDRounded = Enemy Attack - PDDRounded
Calculate the following: MobDamagePDDPercentage = (100 - PDDPercentage) * (Enemy Attack / 100)
Pick the smaller number between MobDamagePDDRounded and MobDamagePDDPercentage. Call this number "damage taken"
If damage taken is less than 1, set damage taken to 1.
Damage taken is the maximum damage you will receive from the enemy.

 For Programmers

Code:

int damage_reduce(int totalWDEF, int charLevel, int mobAttack, int mobLevel)
{
    int PDDRounded;
    double PDDPercentage;
    int PDDRoundedRedux;
    double PDDPercentageRedux;
    int maxDamage;

    PDDRounded = (int)(totalWDEF * 0.25 + 0.5);
    PDDPercentage = (double)floor(sqrt(totalWDEF * 0.25));
    if(mobLevel > charLevel)
    {
        PDDRoundedRedux = 4 * (mobLevel - charLevel);
        if(PDDRoundedRedux > PDDRounded)
        {
            PDDRounded = PDDRoundedRedux;
        }
        PDDRounded -= PDDRoundedRedux;
        PDDPercentageRedux = 2.0 * (mobLevel - charLevel);
        if(PDDPercentageRedux > PDDPercentage)
        {
            PDDPercentage = PDDPercentageRedux;
        }
        PDDPercentage -= PDDPercentageRedux;
    }
    PDDRounded -= mobAttack;
    PDDPercentage = (100 - PDDPercentage) * (mobAttack / 100);
    maxDamage = PDDRounded;
    if(maxDamage > (int)PDDPercentage)
    {
        maxDamage = (int)PDDPercentage;
    }
    if(maxDamage < 1)
    {
        maxDamage = 1;
    }
    return maxDamage;
}

Call me late, but wtp? They removed Visitor PQ?

According to him: http://cujo00.wordpress.com/ we did

Call me late, but wtp? They removed Visitor PQ?

According to him: http://cujo00.wordpress.com/ we did

Just the NPC to get in, the map and PQ itself are still in data.

wut.

 Spoiler

How Mob Damage Works

Relevant Calculator:
Mob Damage Calculator

Relevant Formulas:
WDEF = STR * 1.2 + (DEX + LUK) * 0.5 + INT * 0.4
MDEF = STR * 0.4 + (DEX + LUK) * 0.5 + INT * 1.2
Maximum Character Defense = 30,000
Maximum Mob Attack = 29,999
Maximum Character HP = 99,999
As a rule of thumb, your defense needs to be four times the enemy's attack value in order to receive 1 damage from the enemy's attack.
Having 30,000 defense will reduce all damage by about 86%. The "never receive damage" defense number is 40,000 (Because sqrt(WDEF * 0.25) of 40,000 is 100% in the formula), though it's impossible to reach it.
The enemy's attack value is the damage he will do if you have 0 Defense.
Flat damage reduction will only happen on values 8660 and less (and even then at only absurdly high defense values). Values higher than this are always percentage based damage reduction.
The overall procedure is: Get Mob Attack --> Reduce mob attack by threaten --> Calculate & randomize mob attack --> reduce attack by defense --> reduce attack by other means (Achilles, Combo Barrier, etc.) --> reduce damage by Meso Guard.
For every level you are below the enemy, you effectively lose 16 defense or 2.0% of the enemy's damage.
Threaten does not work on Pink Bean or any of his cohorts.

Procedure:
Calculate the following: PDDRounded = Total WDEF * 0.25 <---- Round this to the nearest whole number
Calculate the following: PDDPercentage = Square Root(Total WDEF * 0.25) <--- Round Down
If your level is less than the mob's level, subtract 4 from PDDRounded for every level. If PDDRounded becomes less than 0 because of this, set PDDRounded to 0.
If your level is less than the mob's level, subtract 2.0 from PDDPercentage for every level. If PDDPercentage becomes less than 0 because of this, set PDDPercentage to 0.
Calculate the following: MobDamagePDDRounded = Enemy Attack - PDDRounded
Calculate the following: MobDamagePDDPercentage = (100 - PDDPercentage) * (Enemy Attack / 100)
Pick the smaller number between MobDamagePDDRounded and MobDamagePDDPercentage. Call this number "damage taken"
If damage taken is less than 1, set damage taken to 1.
Damage taken is the maximum damage you will receive from the enemy.

 For Programmers

Code:

int damage_reduce(int totalWDEF, int charLevel, int mobAttack, int mobLevel)
{
    int PDDRounded;
    double PDDPercentage;
    int PDDRoundedRedux;
    double PDDPercentageRedux;
    int maxDamage;

    PDDRounded = (int)(totalWDEF * 0.25 + 0.5);
    PDDPercentage = (double)floor(sqrt(totalWDEF * 0.25));
    if(mobLevel > charLevel)
    {
        PDDRoundedRedux = 4 * (mobLevel - charLevel);
        if(PDDRoundedRedux > PDDRounded)
        {
            PDDRounded = PDDRoundedRedux;
        }
        PDDRounded -= PDDRoundedRedux;
        PDDPercentageRedux = 2.0 * (mobLevel - charLevel);
        if(PDDPercentageRedux > PDDPercentage)
        {
            PDDPercentage = PDDPercentageRedux;
        }
        PDDPercentage -= PDDPercentageRedux;
    }
    PDDRounded -= mobAttack;
    PDDPercentage = (100 - PDDPercentage) * (mobAttack / 100);
    maxDamage = PDDRounded;
    if(maxDamage > (int)PDDPercentage)
    {
        maxDamage = (int)PDDPercentage;
    }
    if(maxDamage < 1)
    {
        maxDamage = 1;
    }
    return maxDamage;
}

I don't get what you're getting at. Powerguard isnt mention but i think it goes with the pseudo general category that comes right before meso guard. If you're somehow disagreeing with what i said, you're doing it wrong.

I don't get what you're getting at. Powerguard isnt mention but i think it goes with the pseudo general category that comes right before meso guard. If you're somehow disagreeing with what i said, you're doing it wrong.

Funny how you edited your post right after I mentioned it.
Care to be a wonderful example and tell me how it doesn't reduce 50% damage?

Funny how you edited your post right after I mentioned it.
Care to be a wonderful example and tell me how it doesn't reduce 50% damage?

I editted my post right after posting it. also what you quoted hasnt changed in concept one bit. I just added a clarification of what i meant by "truly" that remains just as true as if i took it out. I honestly had not seen your post when i edited.

If powerguard actually did reduce damage by 50% it'd be the same as getting hit by a mob with 1/2 the attack. The thing is it isn't. It's a reduction of a reduction. It is only 50% of whatever wasn't reduced by everything else. so when you take 1's without powergaurd you'd probably still take 1's or at most 2's. This is yet again completely neglecting that with guardian you wont be taking damage at all 42% of the time.

I editted my post right after posting it. also what you quoted hasnt changed in concept one bit. I just added a clarification of what i meant by "truly" that remains just as true as if i took it out. I honestly had not seen your post when i edited.

If powerguard actually did reduce damage by 50% it'd be the same as getting hit by a mob with 1/2 the attack. The thing is it isn't. It's a reduction of a reduction. It is only 50% of whatever wasn't reduced by everything else. so when you take 1's without powergaurd you'd probably still take 1's or at most 2's. This is yet again completely neglecting that with guardian you wont be taking damage at all 42% of the time.

Why would you use 1 to justify your statement? Half of 1 is .5.

 Spoiler

No PG.


With PG.

Defense is 1832 with Iron Body. Threatened they do about 23-65 damage.

Why would you use 1 to justify your statement? Half of 1 is .5.

 Spoiler

No PG.


With PG.

Defense is 1832 with Iron Body.

As to why i use 1:

 Spoiler

How Mob Damage Works

Relevant Calculator:
Mob Damage Calculator

Relevant Formulas:
WDEF = STR * 1.2 + (DEX + LUK) * 0.5 + INT * 0.4
MDEF = STR * 0.4 + (DEX + LUK) * 0.5 + INT * 1.2
Maximum Character Defense = 30,000
Maximum Mob Attack = 29,999
Maximum Character HP = 99,999
As a rule of thumb, your defense needs to be four times the enemy's attack value in order to receive 1 damage from the enemy's attack.
Having 30,000 defense will reduce all damage by about 86%. The "never receive damage" defense number is 40,000 (Because sqrt(WDEF * 0.25) of 40,000 is 100% in the formula), though it's impossible to reach it.
The enemy's attack value is the damage he will do if you have 0 Defense.
Flat damage reduction will only happen on values 8660 and less (and even then at only absurdly high defense values). Values higher than this are always percentage based damage reduction.
The overall procedure is: Get Mob Attack --> Reduce mob attack by threaten --> Calculate & randomize mob attack --> reduce attack by defense --> reduce attack by other means (Achilles, Combo Barrier, etc.) --> reduce damage by Meso Guard.
For every level you are below the enemy, you effectively lose 16 defense or 2.0% of the enemy's damage.
Threaten does not work on Pink Bean or any of his cohorts.

Procedure:
Calculate the following: PDDRounded = Total WDEF * 0.25 <---- Round this to the nearest whole number
Calculate the following: PDDPercentage = Square Root(Total WDEF * 0.25) <--- Round Down
If your level is less than the mob's level, subtract 4 from PDDRounded for every level. If PDDRounded becomes less than 0 because of this, set PDDRounded to 0.
If your level is less than the mob's level, subtract 2.0 from PDDPercentage for every level. If PDDPercentage becomes less than 0 because of this, set PDDPercentage to 0.
Calculate the following: MobDamagePDDRounded = Enemy Attack - PDDRounded
Calculate the following: MobDamagePDDPercentage = (100 - PDDPercentage) * (Enemy Attack / 100)
Pick the smaller number between MobDamagePDDRounded and MobDamagePDDPercentage. Call this number "damage taken"
If damage taken is less than 1, set damage taken to 1.
Damage taken is the maximum damage you will receive from the enemy.

 For Programmers

Code:

int damage_reduce(int totalWDEF, int charLevel, int mobAttack, int mobLevel)
{
    int PDDRounded;
    double PDDPercentage;
    int PDDRoundedRedux;
    double PDDPercentageRedux;
    int maxDamage;

    PDDRounded = (int)(totalWDEF * 0.25 + 0.5);
    PDDPercentage = (double)floor(sqrt(totalWDEF * 0.25));
    if(mobLevel > charLevel)
    {
        PDDRoundedRedux = 4 * (mobLevel - charLevel);
        if(PDDRoundedRedux > PDDRounded)
        {
            PDDRounded = PDDRoundedRedux;
        }
        PDDRounded -= PDDRoundedRedux;
        PDDPercentageRedux = 2.0 * (mobLevel - charLevel);
        if(PDDPercentageRedux > PDDPercentage)
        {
            PDDPercentage = PDDPercentageRedux;
        }
        PDDPercentage -= PDDPercentageRedux;
    }
    PDDRounded -= mobAttack;
    PDDPercentage = (100 - PDDPercentage) * (mobAttack / 100);
    maxDamage = PDDRounded;
    if(maxDamage > (int)PDDPercentage)
    {
        maxDamage = (int)PDDPercentage;
    }
    if(maxDamage < 1)
    {
        maxDamage = 1;
    }
    return maxDamage;
}

As to the rest of your post... The fact that you think that that is contrary to what i am saying just shows you don't get what i'm saying.

As to the rest of your post... The fact that you think that that is contrary to what i am saying just shows you don't get what i'm saying.

Then be more specific, obviously if you think I'm the retarded one in this side of the conversation then you should at least try to be more clear to what you're saying because obviously it's not making sense in my head. As far as I know, you're saying Power Guard is a useless skill and should be replaced with something else. Then you went on to state about how it doesn't protect 50% of the damage and actually reflects "42%".

Apparently Tespia is extended to Wednesday? Just in from IRC.

Then be more specific, obviously if you think I'm the retarded one in this side of the conversation then you should at least try to be more clear to what you're saying because obviously it's not making sense in my head.

open the calculator provided in the spoiler. Input char level as being the same or greater than monster level. Set def to your def. set monsters attack to around 832 (approx the same as death teddies) the damage will come out as 374. (first screenshot) try half of 832 (416) you won't be taking 15x damage. powerguard is not the major player in damage reduction by a long shot. It in no situation accounts for 50% of your damage reduction. yes, you take roughly half of the touch damage you would off with it off, but you need to keep in mind your defense is already working on that reduction you just can see this difference because you can't turn off defense. For a more visble comparison, take damage from a threatened teddy. compare the damage reduction on a skill that says 30% to a skill that says 50%. What the skill says does not entirely account for its effect.

Thought of another good example that would be easy to test. Change your def in the calculator to be half of your actual def. (916) The damage comes out to be 600. half of that would be 300. No powergaurd =/= half your defense + powerguard.

Blabber.

It all depends on the order of reduction. Threaten comes before defense, defense comes before Power Guard, and Power Guard comes after all of that.