2008-07-05, 11:44 PM (This post was last modified: 2008-07-05, 11:54 PM by Hazzy.)
Bribery Wrote:Octopus only attacks one monster at a time, and it seems to attack every second based on the videos. The problem with it is that it doesn't move. It remains stationary in the spot you summon it. It only turns left and right to attack the monsters around it. It's great at places like Newties but I can't imagine it being useful anywhere else (based on GMS training spots). The good thing about it is that it has great range (300). This picture contains Octopus' damage @ level 187. I'm assuming it's maxed.
Spoiler
Seems great on non-mobby maps, more of which seem to be appearing. Temple of Time would be a great place to have a SO. Newties don't mob, so they're good as well. Most 4th job mobs seem to be getting more and more concentrated, bettering the use of this skill.
Quote:I think 16 EA (That's when it hits 2 seconds) before Octopus would be a good idea.
Oh, thought EA's max was 20, not 30.
Quote:I was also considering Maple Warrior early on but it seems like getting the other skills are much more important. How about 16 EA and 19 MW before Support Octopus?
20 MW comes from Horntail. Have the smaller servers, Kradia, Mardia, Bellocan, even killed it once yet? Even if they have, who are the odds a Captain will be HornTailing?
We really need more information about the 4th job skill books so we can craft a build based off of the book availability. :/
Hazzy Wrote:Seems great on non-mobby maps, more of which seem to be appearing. Temple of Time would be a great place to have a SO. Newties don't mob, so they're good as well. Most 4th job mobs seem to be getting more and more concentrated, bettering the use of this skill.
Oh, thought EA's max was 20, not 30.
20 MW comes from Horntail. Have the smaller servers, Kradia, Mardia, Bellocan, even killed it once yet? Even if they have, who are the odds a Captain will be HornTailing?
We really need more information about the 4th job skill books so we can craft a build based off of the book availability. :/
Yeah, Captains + Bosses =
I guess it's better to leave MW to the later levels then. I didn't really want to get it early because it's a universal party skill and most Bishops have level 9 MW by level 130 anyways. The other skills seem more important to me.
I changed the 4th job build to get level 16 AMP before maxing Octopus. Yay for 5 second freeze
what really worries me though is their bossing abilities ... I mean im already sold on everything else except bossing. i mean i can imagine both summons to be tagged with "stop using them your making us lag" issues ... as for the rest of the skills they dont seem solid enough to hold there own against the damage of the party ... and not having a party skill seems to have "paladin" written all over it which is really really worrysome. people say homing is a party skill ... but i doubt it... homing doesnt even seem sensible for training so if it doesnt work while partying i mean sure 20% more of your own damage is good but the party isnt just gonna let you come with them for looks o.0.
Thanks for that. None of the books seem too hard to obtain. Air Strike 30 from Horntail is what I feared but since no one wants Captains @ Horntail, I'm guessing groups will sell them like Meteo/Blizzard 30.
rattown Wrote:what really worries me though is their bossing abilities ... I mean im already sold on everything else except bossing. i mean i can imagine both summons to be tagged with "stop using them your making us lag" issues ... as for the rest of the skills they dont seem solid enough to hold there own against the damage of the party ... and not having a party skill seems to have "paladin" written all over it which is really really worrysome.
I feel exactly the same. I wish they would make Advanced Homing a party skill. According to that level 187 Captain, it used to be a party skill but they changed it
Here's that interview with KMS' #1 Pirate, level 187 Captain. I posted it a few pages back.
Spoiler
Mikako11 of SW.net Wrote:I went on Playforum earlier this week and they interviewed #1 Pirate in KMS, Gunfred, who is a lvl 187 Captain. I'm not going to sit here and translate everything, but i roughly translated the main parts:
Q: What do you think (for Captain job) needs to be fixed/patched?
A: First off, battleship would be the biggest problem. Battleship is maxed at lvl 10, defense goes up but when the ship is destroyed, you must wait 6 min until you can ride it again. During that time you must train with rapid fire. (Rapid fire's) attack speed is fast but low damage. There will be some decrease in your avg EXP. Also, in whole the Gunslinger class's main problem is lack of party skill. Homing for instance changed from party skill to indiv. skill making Gunslinger a narcissistic (?) job. Seriously! Advanced Homing! Needs to be changed to party skill again :crying:
Q: A few questions abut battleship. When leveling up battleship skill, many users are complaining about the increasing recovery time and that the ship itself is slow in speed. What do you think about that? What do you think should be changed?
A: (omitting a few words).......... I think the recovery time really needs to be patched. A skill should improve as you put more points. I don't feel any big difference in def. either. I think delay time should not increase, only the def. of the ship should. Battleship's damage is good as it is, making it go faster would make this a broken class.
Q: Question about rapid fire. Players often complain about the low damage and compare it to the Bowmaster's SOA. If the skill could be buffed, how much do you think would be suitable damage?
A: Most important thing here is
Captain does not train by spamming one skill
Rapid fire has the strongest supporting skill, Air Strike.
Using Air Strike every 5 seconds inbetween rapid fire during training.. everyone gets amazed. Compared to SOA, Rapid Fire just lacks the critical. Firing speed is faster as well :nothing: ((( I think he might be wrong )))
My Rapid Fire damage is about 6~7k. I doubt my killing speed would be slower than a Bowmaster at the same level. Also I throw out 2 of my cute Octopus to help me :excited:
*He claims that Rapid Fire is clearly faster than SOA but... who knows.
One more thing about Rapid Fire... (Nexon) please adjust the shooting angle (for monsters at higher or lower platform) ... NL's TT and Bmaster's SOA has wider range than Rapid Fire, lot of missed shots during Horntail.
Q: What do you think about Mind Control and Air strike? What do you think needs to be changed?
A: Every job has a skill that is never used. Like Hero's Monster Magnet. It's more like a 'fan service' skill. (Mind Control) other players like it when I use to show it off. Useless for training. Just put 1 point for fun. Air strike.. if it is buffed, other jobs will complain. Would be nice if delay goes down to 3 seconds but it is a good skill even now.
Other things he mentioned.........
-1st and 2nd job's damage was so weak, he considered killing snails hoping for faster exp
-Gunslinger is a difficult class to play, due to weak damage, constant death, no one wanting to party. But later on it becomes strong. The pirate ranking used to be all Infighters, but recently gunslingers are creeping toward the top.
homing b4 amp seems very very unsensible considering amp doubles the damage of a skill you use every 4 seconds where you wont even think of using homing while training. sure maybe at bosses .. but you wont be seeing many of those when you have no party skills...
hmm most bosses already drop skills for them ... maybe ea 30 drops somewhere where no one trains often enough for it to drop o.0. shouldnt the monsterbook list the skill drops under the monsters o.0. hmm.
rattown Wrote:homing b4 amp seems very very unsensible considering amp doubles the damage of a skill you use every 4 seconds where you wont even think of using homing while training. sure maybe at bosses .. but you wont be seeing many of those when you have no party skills...
hmm most bosses already drop skills for them ... maybe ea 30 drops somewhere where no one trains often enough for it to drop o.0. shouldnt the monsterbook list the skill drops under the monsters o.0. hmm.
Good points, but Advanced Homing is better than you think. It does a hefty 580% damage and increases your damage done to a 'Homed' monster by 20%. If you're training with Rapid Fire, it would be best to use Advanced Homing first, then start using Rapid Fire for an extra 20% damage.
Hazzy Wrote:Whoa! Advanced Homing would be a freaking great Party skill!
580% damage to all the skills on the monster?
It's not a 580% damage increase, it's a 20% increase. The 580% is the damage that Advanced Homing does. Still, a 20% damage increase is nothing to shun at.
2008-07-06, 12:24 AM (This post was last modified: 2008-07-06, 12:27 AM by Hazzy.)
Bribery Wrote:Good points, but Advanced Homing is better than you think. It does a hefty 580% damage and increases your damage done to a 'Homed' monster by 20%. If you're training with Rapid Fire, it would be best to use Advanced Homing first, then start using Rapid Fire for an extra 20% damage.
Wait, how does AH work? D:
Bribery Wrote:It's not a 580% damage increase, it's a 20% increase. The 580% is the damage that Advanced Homing does. Still, a 20% damage increase is nothing to shun at.
Awwwww. 580% would have owned. D:
Still 20% increase in damage? That's hawt.
2008-07-06, 12:28 AM (This post was last modified: 2008-07-06, 12:33 AM by rattown.)
Bribery Wrote:Good points, but Advanced Homing is better than you think. It does a hefty 580% damage and increases your damage done to a 'Homed' monster by 20%. If you're training with Rapid Fire, it would be best to use Advanced Homing first, then start using Rapid Fire for an extra 20% damage.
It's not a 580% damage increase, it's a 20% increase. The 580% is the damage that Advanced Homing does. Still, a 20% damage increase is nothing to shun at.
Mikako11 of SW.net Wrote:Q: What do you think about Mind Control and Air strike? What do you think needs to be changed?
A: Every job has a skill that is never used. Like Hero's Monster Magnet. It's more like a 'fan service' skill. (Mind Control) other players like it when I use to show it off. Useless for training. Just put 1 point for fun. Air strike.. if it is buffed, other jobs will complain. Would be nice if delay goes down to 3 seconds but it is a good skill even now.
if the level 187 captain says its the monster magnet of the class ... i think it means its the last skill you max ... i.e. useless... you wouldnt use it before rapid cause its faster to just rapid all the way rather than homing followed by rapid .... monsters wouldnt last 3 seconds after you max rapid ... 20% of 3 seconds is like .6 seconds ... and thats about the human reaction time for changing from skill to skill and noticing monster is dead etc ... meaning its not useful at all while training. holding down rapid and changing in between with freeze so as not to get hit is much more sensible watch the 155 bm vs captain vid ... she is clearly using freeze alot.
the other wierd thing with pirate 4th job is the fact that they have 0 skills alike in 4th job ... all other 4th job have atleast 1 alike skill. like monster magnet fake venom mana reflection sharp eyes etc etc etc.
rattown Wrote:if the level 187 captain says its the monster magnet of the class ... i think it means its the last skill you max ... i.e. useless... you wouldnt use it before rapid cause its faster to just rapid all the way rather than homing followed by rapid .... monsters wouldnt last 3 seconds after you max rapid ... 20% of 3 seconds is like .6 seconds ... and thats about the human reaction time for changing from skill to skill and noticing monster is dead etc ... meaning its not useful at all while training. holding down rapid and changing in between with freeze so as not to get hit is much more sensible watch the 155 bm vs captain vid ... she is clearly using freeze alot.
When you use AH on a monster it deals 580% damage. Then the monster is now "Homed" (Indicated by a Parrot on the monster's head ) and all your attacks will do an extra 20% on the "homed" monster. Additionally, all attacks will be directed to that monster. Ex/You're using Rapid Fire on a "homed" monster when another spawns in front of you. Rapid Fire would go through the newly spawned monster and still attack the "homed" monster until it dies.
rattown Wrote:if the level 187 captain says its the monster magnet of the class ... i think it means its the last skill you max ... i.e. useless... you wouldnt use it before rapid cause its faster to just rapid all the way rather than homing followed by rapid .... monsters wouldnt last 3 seconds after you max rapid ... 20% of 3 seconds is like .04 seconds ... and thats about the human reaction time ... meaning its not useful at all while training.
He said Mind Control is the useless skill, which IMO it is. I think Advanced Homing is great especially since Rapid Fire doesn't have Critical + Sharp Eyes to aid it like a Bowmaster's Hurricane does. Plus, Advanced Homing does quite a bit of damage on it's own. 580% damage shaves off nearly 4 shots of Rapid Fire.
2008-07-06, 12:35 AM (This post was last modified: 2008-07-06, 12:39 AM by rattown.)
Bribery Wrote:Here's how I understand it:
When you use AH on a monster it deals 580% damage. Then the monster is now "Homed" (Indicated by a Parrot on the monster's head ) and all your attacks will do an extra 20% on the "homed" monster. Additionally, all attacks will be directed to that monster. Ex/You're using Rapid Fire on a "homed" monster when another spawns in front of you. Rapid Fire would go through the newly spawned monster and still attack the "homed" monster until it dies.
He said Mind Control is the useless skill, which IMO it is. I think Advanced Homing is great especially since Rapid Fire doesn't have Critical + Sharp Eyes to aid it like a Bowmaster's Hurricane does.
whoops thought he said homing my bad. but still if you look at the vid she doesnt go homing rapid she goes freeze rapid. you cant compare advanced homing to sharp eyes ... its like comparing a snail to horntail ... advanced homing is like showdown of thiefs... it slows down your regular attacks and it cant be used on all monsters in the screen just the 1 monster you use it on. i can see it being ok for papping and zakuming and painusing (doubt youll ht) ... but i cant see it being useful otherwise.
rattown Wrote:whoops thought he said homing my bad. but still if you look at the vid she doesnt go homing rapid she goes freeze rapid. you cant compare advanced homing to sharp eyes ... its like comparing a snail to horntail ... advanced homing is like showdown of thiefs... it slows down your regular attacks and it cant be used on all monsters in the screen just the 1 monster you use it on. i can see it being ok for papping solo and zakuming solo(if thats even possible with no soul bullet) ... but i cant see it being useful otherwise.
That's true, valid points. But you really can't compare Advanced Homing to Showdown because Advanced Homing actually does decent damage. 580% is nothing to simply brush aside since it's more raw damage than a lot of Gunslinger skills. A lot of the Gunslinger builds I've seen put off AMP until later levels. I think it's mainly used for the increase in timer, not the damage.
Bribery Wrote:That's true, valid points. But you really can't compare Advanced Homing to Showdown because Advanced Homing actually does decent damage. 580% is nothing to simply brush aside since it's more raw damage than a lot of Gunslinger skills. A lot of the Gunslinger builds I've seen put off AMP until later levels. I think it's mainly used for the increase in timer, not the damage.
I think it can be brushed off when amp makes the damage of a skill you have used since 3rd job doubled... brushing off amp is like saying brush off sharp eyes for dragon roar or brush off beserk for rush.
rattown Wrote:I think it can be brushed off when amp makes the damage of a skill you have used since 3rd job doubled... brushing off amp is like saying brush off sharp eyes for dragon roar or brush off beserk for rush.
More than double. o_o
130% to 330% is amazing. Even at 16, when it first adds two seconds, it adds 106% damage, which almost doubles CE (Cooling Effect). 236% is pretty dang good. >:O
Unless, of course, EA multiplies the elemental skill by that percentage, but that seems unlikely as it takes 15 levels just to get to 100%.
![[Image: 25393089to0.jpg]](http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/5483/25393089to0.jpg)
Still, a 20% damage increase is nothing to shun at.
