Would you quit because of Elemental Wands/Staves?

That pretty much sums it up. Of course they are geared towards AMs, obviously. (@MysticHLE) What makes you think they are not?

I'm not Lukless. I do own an Elemental Wand. I have spent my own money on this game. Thousands of dollars, in fact (which makes it a little sad considering I don't have time to play much anymore).

:f6:

Then my follow up question is:

Do you 100% 1 hit KO Skelegons and Skelosaurus yet?
And if so, would you still be able to if your magic was lowered by 50 (minimum magic to 100% 1 hit KO Skelosaurus with Genesis 30 is ~1300)?
If you still can, then it is obvious why you wouldn't care.
If you are not even close, then it is also obvious as to why you wouldn't care.

But if you are on the borderline, or if that was a goal you are very close in reaching, how would you feel if they took that goal/accomplishment out of your reach again?

Then my follow up question is:

Do you 100% 1 hit KO Skelegons and Skelosaurus yet?
And if so, would you still be able to if your magic was lowered by 50 (minimum magic to 100% 1 hit KO Skelosaurus with Genesis 30 is ~1300)?
If you still can, then it is obvious why you wouldn't care.
If you are not even close, then it is also obvious as to why you wouldn't care.

But if you are on the borderline, or if that was a goal you are very close in reaching, how would you feel if they took that goal/accomplishment out of your reach again?

So level up again until you can. How long would that be, in all honesty? It's hard to complain for me because all we have to do is spam our ultimates and move around a bit. I can 2HKO Skeles and level 3 times faster than attackers, even after being reduced.

So level up again until you can.

What level are you? And why didn't you answer my question?

EDIT: Then you do not begin to understand the difference in training compared to a 1 hit KOer at level 170. So I don't expect you to sympathize or begin to understand the impact it would have on them either.

What level are you? And why didn't you answer my question?

Effective avoidance. Asking twice won't get you an answer.
That point is moot. Because, in the end, it won't matter. After they fix, nerf, or whatever they do to the wands, if anything, whining will not get you (or me, or eos) anywhere.

I could lie and make stuff up and the point wouldn't change. I can be pretty empathetic, since the routine is the same whether it's me or you.

Waaah if this goes into effect I can't 1HKO the strongest monsters in the game.

TIP: NO ONE ELSE CAN EITHER.

Do you not get how petty you sound about this?

Effective avoidance. Asking twice won't get you an answer.
That point is moot. Because, in the end, it won't matter. After they fix, nerf, or whatever they do to the wands, if anything, whining will not get you anywhere.

I could lie and make stuff up and the point wouldn't change. I can be pretty empathetic, since the routine is the same whether it's me or you.

Thanks for proving my point that you cannot sympathize and relate, thus leading to your conclusion and way of thinking. You're also not on ranks as that IGN.

Waaah if this goes into effect I can't 1HKO the strongest monsters in the game.

TIP: NO ONE ELSE CAN EITHER.

This post shows your ignorance. BTW and FYI I break 90k damage (12 atk. pot, no SE) as a Paladin on Skeles at level 169 now.

Thanks for proving my point that you cannot sympathize and relate, thus leading to your conclusion and way of thinking. You're also not on ranks as that IGN.

Of course, simply because I do not choose to agree with you, means I can't sympathize? Thanks, but I can think for myself.

Anywho, I hope they decide to put the wands the way they were created to be, and give the effect they were supposed, which is evening out the unfairness you obviously perpetuate. All the advantages Bishops already have (obviously noted by the sheer # of lol200bishops on ranks) and people want to whine because of such a change?

*cough*

Thanks for proving my point that you cannot sympathize and relate, thus leading to your conclusion and way of thinking. You're also not on ranks as that IGN.

Your understanding of "points" seems very selective. Where are the Bishops who would vote "Yes" on this poll, again?

Waaah if this goes into effect I can't 1HKO the strongest monsters in the game.

TIP: NO ONE ELSE CAN EITHER.

Do you not get how petty you sound about this?

*1HKO 15 of the strongest monsters in the game at the same time.

Thanks for proving my point that you cannot sympathize and This post shows your ignorance. BTW and FYI I break 90k damage (12 atk. pot, no SE) as a Paladin on Skeles at level 169 now.

I know people from every job, and none of them can perch in a single spot and kill 15 enemies at the same time regardless of their damage/level. You're crying about losing the ability to do this IN ONE HIT which as far as I know, no one else can do.

I would say it was pretty obvious I didn't mean single enemies but I'll still apologise for not being clear, because I should have been.

Bishops have posted their indifference in the former thread. I don't think you can speak for all or even most Bishops as they're a subcommunity with differing opinions. You'd be right to say you're attempting to represent the small fraction of Bishops who do own elemental wands/staves, though.


Implying that the other side is "conniving" and/or bloating their argument has never helped a discussion, for the record.

I also believe we'd all be better of realizing we're not infallible.

Correction: 1 bishop posted his indifference in the other thread (and for that matter, I'd like to see an onrank IGN for that too). There are maybe 10-15 bishops that actively peruse these forums insofar as I'm aware, and you can say that 1 or 2 posted indifference to the situation. If we're going to go by whatever statistical nonsense was intended from this thread, then I've got to say that, extrapolating that to the bishop population as a whole, that's a bunch of bishops that are about to quit

Eos is certainly a distinguished member of this forum and others, however, that does not justify intellectually dishonest or logical fallacies that have been rife in discussion. This "poll" clearly does nothing but refute false evidence that people don't care, and is in reference to a larger strawman argument that people don't care because....other classes don't care? I will admire the work that this member has published on these forums, but this is clearly intended as a gimmick more than it is anything that would facilitate meaningful discussion on the subject matter.

No matter how many times you repeat something, it doesn't make it reality.

This "impact" is in your head.
There will not even be a statistical blip from this fix as far as population goes.

People stopped playing priests because prior to 4th job they had absolutely nothing to offer beyond being someone's HS mule and/or heal slave.

These weapons didn't change that. Genesis did.
Genesis isn't going any where, and being related to 3rd most destructive grinder instead of #1 isn't exactly the end of the world when there are 10 other classes behind you day dreaming about being able to wreak the level of destruction your whiny ass can but isn't satifised with.

You can't qualify those statements in any way shape or form. This entire time your posts have been quick to dismiss the potential for implications on the bishop class that uses these wands despite this being an important issue. In fact, I would find it extremely hypocritical considering you've been party to this repetition as well, often without expressing these opinions in meaningful ways either. Furthermore, the argument about bishops quitting is peripheral to the understanding that this would constitute a financial hit on Nexon. Bishops might not quit, but the fact that the 6 and 8 wands will be flooding the market sure as heck means that people won't be spending more tickets when they gach. The difference between someone buying 100 tickets and 200 tickets, I'm sure, is a well understood one, even by someone so loathe to grasp such concepts.

YES. OH GOD YES WOULD I QUIT MAPLE AND LEAVE ALL MY CHARACTERS. THIS WOULD MAKE ME SO ANGRY THAT I WOULD NOT ONLY QUIT, I'D FRICKIN DELETE ALL OF THEM. WITH ALL MY GEAR ON THEM. YEAH.

WoW I CAN NOT EVEN BEGIN TO EXPRESS MY RAGE IF THIS HAPPENED. ELE WANDS LOWERING MY DAMAGE? OH HELL NO. UNACCEPTABLE. ABSOLUTELY UNACCEPTABLE. NEXON HAS PISSED ME OFF BEFORE, BUT THIS WOULD BE THE FINAL STRAW. NO QUESTIONS. LOWER MY DAMAGE? SCREW YOU. I'M GONE. ALDSKFAJSL BISHOPS ARE LIKE MY LIFE AND SOUL. THE ULTIMATE CLASS. I'D HAVE TO DEGRADE TO SOME OLD WEAPON. SERIOUSLY, HOW IS THAT EVEN FAIR? IF MAGES GET FANCY ELE WEAPONS, I WANT TO BE ABLE TO USE THEM TOO. SO STUPID. GMS OBVIOUSLY KEPT THE DAMAGE REDUCTION OFF CAUSE THEY REALIZE BISHOPS ARE THE ULTIMATE, AS WELL.

SO YEAH. YEAH. I WOULD QUIT MAPLESTORY IF THIS HAPPENED. I JUST DON'T SEE HOW I'D BE ABLE TO PLAY WITH LOWER DAMAGE AND KNOWING MAGES STILL GET TO USE THEM. FRICKIN INJUSTICE.

YES. OH GOD YES WOULD I QUIT MAPLE AND LEAVE ALL MY CHARACTERS. THIS WOULD MAKE ME SO ANGRY THAT I WOULD NOT ONLY QUIT, I'D FRICKIN DELETE ALL OF THEM. WITH ALL MY GEAR ON THEM. YEAH.

WoW I CAN NOT EVEN BEGIN TO EXPRESS MY RAGE IF THIS HAPPENED. ELE WANDS LOWERING MY DAMAGE? OH HELL NO. UNACCEPTABLE. ABSOLUTELY UNACCEPTABLE. NEXON HAS PISSED ME OFF BEFORE, BUT THIS WOULD BE THE FINAL STRAW. NO QUESTIONS. LOWER MY DAMAGE? SCREW YOU. I'M GONE. ALDSKFAJSL BISHOPS ARE LIKE MY LIFE AND SOUL. THE ULTIMATE CLASS. I'D HAVE TO DEGRADE TO SOME OLD WEAPON. SERIOUSLY, HOW IS THAT EVEN FAIR? IF MAGES GET FANCY ELE WEAPONS, I WANT TO BE ABLE TO USE THEM TOO. SO STUPID. GMS OBVIOUSLY KEPT THE DAMAGE REDUCTION OFF CAUSE THEY REALIZE BISHOPS ARE THE ULTIMATE, AS WELL.

SO YEAH. YEAH. I WOULD QUIT MAPLESTORY IF THIS HAPPENED. I JUST DON'T SEE HOW I'D BE ABLE TO PLAY WITH LOWER DAMAGE AND KNOWING MAGES STILL GET TO USE THEM. FRICKIN INJUSTICE.

I can't tell this is sarcasm or not [/sarcasm].

Look, all of this argueing is not going to get us anywhere. I've come to realize that there is always going to be people who see this from both sides and to be 100% honest, both sides have perfectly unbiased points that make sense. Trying to disprove each other isn't going to get us anywhere because the fact is that no matter what they do about this issue, one side of the players are going to look at is at right and one side of the players going to look at it as wrong. It's going to effect somebody whether they add the 0.75x reduction or not.

The fact is that these weapons SHOULD be fixed because they do indeed have the 0.75x Modifier in other versions and they were originally intended for Arch Mages. I'm not sure if Nexon intended for these weapons to be able to be equipped by Bishops just so they could make more money or if they implemented them wrong and forgot to add the 0.75x modifier but either way I can see why Arch Mages would want this fixed.

However, They SHOULDN'T be fixed because If they fix these weapons, even though I highly doubt many players will quit, it will undoubtedly be unfair to the Bishops who purchased these weapons in the past ten months with the understanding that they would not weaken them in GMS.

You can throw all the figures you want at me but the fact is that these weapons don't say anywhere on them that they reduce the m.atk of Bishops by equipping them and have not reduced the m.atk of Bishops who have been using them for the past ten months in GMS. Fact is there are already so many Bishops wearing these weapons that, in my opinion, it would be wrong to change them on a whim after so long after so many Bishops have already spent their mesos on them.

Both sides have been whining long enough, you may as well just let it rest and see what Nexon has to say on the matter before debating this any further because it's just going to go around in a circle.

The difference between someone buying 100 tickets and 200 tickets, I'm sure, is a well understood one, even by someone so loathe to grasp such concepts.

People have not seriously gached explicitly for Eles in months. Most of us who had the money to do it, either got them, or ended up buying them from someone who did.

You keep espousing your view points as if you have anything more solid than your opinion to back you up.

Lets check the facts.

Do you know Nexon's business plans? No.
Do you know how much of their NX sales directly correlate to these items? No.
Do you know if Nexon even has a clue of that information? No.

You're making predictions, wildly dramatic ones, based on your opinion, with no supporting evidence, that doing this will hurt everyone and everything. That it will rip a hole in the social fabric of GMS and destroy us all, or whatever.

It's simply not going to happen. People are a whole are too adaptive for this to ever matter.

I've watched a playerbase go through three successive pwipes in a six month stretch, and still keep playing, yet you think them losing one shiny weapon is going to bring about armageddon.

B>2.5 i voted 2 because i care but i wouldn't be overly pissed

People have not seriously gached explicitly for Eles in months. Most of us who had the money to do it, either got them, or ended up buying them from someone who did.

You keep espousing your view points as if you have anything more solid than your opinion to back you up.

Lets check the facts.

Do you know Nexon's business plans? No.
Do you know how much of their NX sales directly correlate to these items? No.
Do you know if Nexon even has a clue of that information? No.

You're making predictions, wildly dramatic ones, based on your opinion, with no supporting evidence, that doing this will hurt everyone and everything. That it will rip a hole in the social fabric of GMS and destroy us all, or whatever.

It's simply not going to happen. People are a whole are too adaptive for this to ever matter.

I've watched a playerbase go through three successive pwipes in a six month stretch, and still keep playing, yet you think them losing one shiny weapon is going to bring about armageddon.

You may say that they haven't seriously gached for them, but its quite obvious that again and again you point this out while ignoring the immense draw they have for gachers. I'm not talking about mages gaching this thing; I'm talking about those people that use their allowances to buy gach so they can fund their char in other ways. Mages probably long since gave up gaching to get these for your aforementioned reasons, but there are still people that use gached items to fund their character, and that is primarily where the new wands (technically ALL wands since mages would just keep the wand to themselves most of the time) are coming from now. Again, if you wanted to turn a profit at gach, this is probably the easiest way to do so. Knowing that they're 1Bill apiece makes it appealing to spend much more money than if they were 200Mill apiece. While the aim is probably just to get a few dark scrolls and such, there is still a gambler-esque allure to the potential for an ele wand that makes many people willing to stake their allowances and pay to go gach just a few (hundred) more tickets. No, these aren't bishops or archmages; they're everyone else. I don't make the claim that these people will quit as a result of a change, but I will make the claim that they sure as heck won't be gaching as much as they did before.

Just because I don't know the Nexon business model doesn't mean that I can't state the obvious, and the obvious is that this is an incredibly lucrative weapon for Nexon. If they want to slaughter the cash cow, then fine, but I'm arguing from a pragmatic perspective knowing full well that businesses in this climate aren't privy to intentionally lowering sales in any way possible. Turning the "sky is falling" argument back on me might be good in the context of repetition, but clearly misconstruing my intentions and my arguments is not going anywhere. What we know is that a reduction will make bishops unload their weapons. They're not going to keep them, and there are a heckuvalot more bishops than there are archmages. The bishops will unload weapons en masse, and many will lose a lot of money since the prices will have to be low to reflect the fact that most of their wands are 6 and 8 (thus providing almost no immediate assistance to the archmages that expect their primary stat weapons to drop in value). The price for the weapons will decrease, especially clean ones. What effect that has on people gaching is what we debate, but even the most ardent reduction supporter would not be as obstinate as to say this has no negative implications. Since demand generated greater supply earlier due to both archmages and bishops wanting it, the supply left when bishops unloaded theirs would be enough to establish a much lower constant price that will dissuade people from factoring in an elemental wand into their consideration when gaching. New wands will therefore be rare and drive the price of 5 and 7 up still, despite not having as many new wands coming in (because the demand stimulated suppliers to gach for both wands, and when half that demand is gone...). The fact that Nexon released goggles of all things would also least suggest that they have people occasionally perusing these forums

This thread has useless discussion. You are going waaaay too deep in the subject.

Let's go for a double fix... 0.75 element and make Mana Bulls only work for non-Bishops. The real problem is that with 20k MP, you're looking at 800 mesos per lv.30 Genesis - which is ridiculously cheap for an effective fullscreen nuke, when any single monster it hits drops more than 800 mesos.

You may say that they haven't seriously gached for them, but its quite obvious that again and again you point this out while ignoring the immense draw they have for gachers. I'm not talking about mages gaching this thing; I'm talking about those people that use their allowances to buy gach so they can fund their char in other ways. Mages probably long since gave up gaching to get these for your aforementioned reasons, but there are still people that use gached items to fund their character, and that is primarily where the new wands (technically ALL wands since mages would just keep the wand to themselves most of the time) are coming from now. Again, if you wanted to turn a profit at gach, this is probably the easiest way to do so. Knowing that they're 1Bill apiece makes it appealing to spend much more money than if they were 200Mill apiece. While the aim is probably just to get a few dark scrolls and such, there is still a gambler-esque allure to the potential for an ele wand that makes many people willing to stake their allowances and pay to go gach just a few (hundred) more tickets. No, these aren't bishops or archmages; they're everyone else. I don't make the claim that these people will quit as a result of a change, but I will make the claim that they sure as heck won't be gaching as much as they did before.

Just because I don't know the Nexon business model doesn't mean that I can't state the obvious, and the obvious is that this is an incredibly lucrative weapon for Nexon. If they want to slaughter the cash cow, then fine, but I'm arguing from a pragmatic perspective knowing full well that businesses in this climate aren't privy to intentionally lowering sales in any way possible. Turning the "sky is falling" argument back on me might be good in the context of repetition, but clearly misconstruing my intentions and my arguments is not going anywhere. What we know is that a reduction will make bishops unload their weapons. They're not going to keep them, and there are a heckuvalot more bishops than there are archmages. The bishops will unload weapons en masse, and many will lose a lot of money since the prices will have to be low to reflect the fact that most of their wands are 6 and 8 (thus providing almost no immediate assistance to the archmages that expect their primary stat weapons to drop in value). The price for the weapons will decrease, especially clean ones. What effect that has on people gaching is what we debate, but even the most ardent reduction supporter would not be as obstinate as to say this has no negative implications. Since demand generated greater supply earlier due to both archmages and bishops wanting it, the supply left when bishops unloaded theirs would be enough to establish a much lower constant price that will dissuade people from factoring in an elemental wand into their consideration when gaching. New wands will therefore be rare and drive the price of 5 and 7 up still, despite not having as many new wands coming in (because the demand stimulated suppliers to gach for both wands, and when half that demand is gone...). The fact that Nexon released goggles of all things would also least suggest that they have people occasionally perusing these forums

You know, I've seen more Bishops using wand 7 than any other kind.

And lol@ the results. 1 person would quit due to this out of ~70 would quit due to them changing it.

And Gacha would still have just much of a lure for people as before.

So you said that Bishops would sell their wands, putting more 6's and 8's into the system, which keeps 5 and 7 just as high. Even if prices drop at first, they'll eventually go back up because people will stop gaching for them and less supply will be in the system. With these new prices, people would go gach again.