Clean Slate Glitch?

im still waiting to see a before and after picture of someone pulling this off... because its all still speculation and a great way to inflate crappy slates... i wanna see an item thats been scrolled very well like +4 14atk SCG, then do the slate+white scroll and get the slot back.

...because its all still speculation and a great way to inflate crappy slates...

No, it isn't. It's a fact: there's a glitch with clean slates. Period. Just go on Sleepywood and check out the thread about the glitch. You will see that some people posted screenshots of some godly items. Also, people don't buy items for 200m each unless they are SURE there's a glitch with them.

All this glitch/not glitch argument is just silly. The jump-attack feature became an abuse. It didnt become a feature. We took advantage of that and abuse it.

The bigfoot glitch, some said it was intentional (by Hime), some said otherwise. Either way, people got banned.

Someone got banned by aligning their screen a little bit off pinaus, so some screen attacks on pianus' screen didnt hit that person. That person got banned for "partial-godmodding"

Back during the viking maps bug, bullets from vikings on your right misses the top half of your body, whereas vikings on your left misses the bottom half.

Etc....

So what is this issue? IMO, it's a bug, a programming error which causes un-intended abuses. White scroll supposed to save a slot, how can you save something you didnt lose in the first place? White scrolls didnt work as intended. What's the worst implications? Perhaps someone could abuse this on a lunchbox with GM scrolls to add more slots than it allows?

At the end of the day, it is something unintended. But unlike the bigfoot glitch, this one involves NX, so I guess we'll most likely suck it up and move on. After all, there's only a limited number of whitescrolls, and stuff-ups like this increases their revenue after all.

By you logic it's a glitch because Nexon hasn't stated their intentions towards their functionality, however the description of a white scroll is:

One of Subani’s sacred Scrolls. If used in conjunction with a normal or Dark Scroll, the number of item upgrade slots will not be deducted if the scroll fails. However, if using a Dark Scroll, there is still a chance that your weapon will be destroyed.

The glitch occurs when used with scrolls that are neither normal, nor dark.
This means the item is performing outside of the stated context, and this is a glitch until the description is corrected or amended to restate the new purpose/functionality.

Any time a statement of functional intent is provided behavior outside that stated intent is considered a glitch. It does not require the creator to come back and also add "btw, if it does anything other than it's described properties it's a glitch". It's a glitch by the intrinsic value of defying it's description/purpose.

Ah, I see. Now you have somewhat convinced me that it is a glitch, simply by pointing out where it was not intended. However, by your logic:

HP washing would not be a glitch because the system performs exactly as described in all portions of the process. If anything HP washing is creative use of the game mechanics. If the description of white scrolls were updated to say they reverse any form of slot loss, then this too would be creative usage of game mechanics.

I can call HP Washing is a glitch, simply because they did not address it at all. They did not say anywhere on the AP Resets that by putting in HP, you could pull out MP and vice versa. They simply left it in as a feature.

In a similar way, the white scroll does not say that it is limited to usage only with normal or dark scrolls. It merely mentions the two.

ps: i'm maplesyrop from that post earlier and trust me the drop rate is as low as nependeath honey

That's what I would expect. If they were common, then the Chaos scrolls would have flooded the market before the box event even came out.

IMO the only advantage this method has on using white scrolls regularly is that you are not limited to 7 slots. is it worth the money? i dont think so, but equips deflations are always good.

I have yet to see a screenshot of this happening but I'd really like to see a +6 PAC.

Seriously though. It's essentially a 500m+ price tag for a 9x% clean slate scroll. Big deal...

If you're really intent on landing an extra 30%, you'll likely be paying somewhere near max mesos, and there's still a significant chance to nuke the item with the 30% (plus the more negligible chance for the slate to break it). And if you wanted to be safe and not take chances with breaking, you'd be forced to use a 10%, meaning spending upwards of 5b mesos to land one scroll.

Actually, if you're just going to land 10%s, you might as well not use the Clean Slate because just using the 10% and white scroll would achieve the same effect.

im still waiting to see a before and after picture of someone pulling this off... because its all still speculation and a great way to inflate crappy slates... i wanna see an item thats been scrolled very well like +4 14atk SCG, then do the slate+white scroll and get the slot back.

Eh? Are you oblivious? There's a screenshot in this very thread proving this already.

Perhaps someone could abuse this on a lunchbox with GM scrolls to add more slots than it allows?

That is impossible. The only way you can achieve more than maxed slots on an item is by using a Cold Protection scroll or a Shoe Spike scroll and those still have yet to be proven.

At the end of the day, it is something unintended. But unlike the bigfoot glitch, this one involves NX, so I guess we'll most likely suck it up and move on. After all, there's only a limited number of whitescrolls, and stuff-ups like this increases their revenue after all.

That's true. Things like this in my opinion don't deserve priority. If they fix this and let the no-delay stuff slide, I'm sure everyone will be more upset even though they're complaining already.

I dont know the actual mechanics of No-delay, but my guess involves repacking. That's is something on the client side, mostly. Fixing client-sided stuff isnt a simple task. The scope and span is huge.

Scrolling on the other side, is on the server. This can be fixed easily. Adding a little structures and this issue shouldnt be happening in the future (easier said than done tho).

I dont know the actual mechanics of No-delay, but my guess involves repacking. That's is something on the client side, mostly. Fixing client-sided stuff isnt a simple task. The scope and span is huge.

Scrolling on the other side, is on the server. This can be fixed easily. Adding a little structures and this issue shouldnt be happening in the future (easier said than done tho).

Couldn't they just make the server disconnect you if you send too many attacks at once? Seems like a simple enough solution.

Couldn't they just make the server disconnect you if you send too many attacks at once? Seems like a simple enough solution.

Hurricane. Rapid fire.

Oh noes.

Fixing client sided stuff doesn't sound so hard if they just took the time to implement some server sided checks that hopefully doesn't interfere with the rest of us.

Hurricane. Rapid fire.

Oh noes.

Fixing client sided stuff doesn't sound so hard if they just took the time to implement some server sided checks that hopefully doesn't interfere with the rest of us.

Then make it skill dependent. Store on the server the max amount of times each skill can be used in, say, 5 seconds. Then, if you use it more than that within a 5 second span, you get booted.

I'm fairly certain that they already do something similar for damage and hitboxes.

But anyway, that's irrelevant. Back to clean slate glitch.

@Russt, it's not feasible disconnecting them. The Client-Server architecture using TCP does some resending when failed. Also, due to traffic congestions, sometimes the server hits with a bunch of packets. Also, keeping track of how many attacks per minute is just huge. The cost needed to count every characters on a server makes it not feasible. Also, to be able to choose the correct frequency is tricky. What stops the hacker from attacking x times, pause, attack x times, pause?

@ Takebacker, that's probably the way to go, however, knowing Nexon, hoping that the fix "doesn't interfere with the rest of us" isnt something I am willing to place my money on.

Here's the problem though. While you may consider it a glitch, it is not a glitch until declared one.

Therefore:
1. Is it a glitch? No
2. Is expoliting a glitch against the ToS? Yes
3. Are people exploiting the glitch? No, because there is no glitch.
4. Should a punishment be issues? Since people cannot exploit a nonexistant glitch, there may be no punishments until a 'glitch' is declared.

Eh, no it doesn't. Please read more carefully. Your 1-4 list only applies to his first 2 points. It's completely unrelated to point 3.

You're honestly a fool if you think it's not a glitch until Nexon says so. *facepalm*

You're honestly a fool if you think it's not a glitch until Nexon says so. *facepalm*

And you're honestly a fool if you believe that everyone who has conflicting views with you are fools.

I'm neither calling a glitch, nor a nonglitch. Rather, it's just a phenomenon, a feature, an incidence, something that's there. Even if it may look like a glitch, there's nothing clearly indicating that it is a glitch. The only way now to determine that would be for Nexon to declare something or change the descriptions of the scroll or the way the scroll works, ect.

I wouldn't call it a glitch. The scrolls are just doing their job. Someone just happened to get the effects of the scrolls, put 2 and 2 together, and use it to their advantage.

Will Nexon call it a glitch themselves? Maybe. They may not though.

This isn't one of those glitches where you can over abuse it. Only the rich. ;D

I still think you are better off scrolling a +5 30% Item, and White Scrolling + 10%ing the rest.

Hurr durr derp de derp durrr hurr.

"Hurr hurr I'm one of those Fire Mages who glitched Bigfoot before Nexon said anything therefore I'm still legit. As long as Nexon has no official notice I'm free to do whatever I want. ^__^ DERP."

"Hurr hurr I'm one of those Fire Mages who glitched Bigfoot before Nexon said anything therefore I'm still legit. As long as Nexon has no official notice I'm free to do whatever I want. ^__^ DERP."

I didn't have to change anything in my wz files to poison bigfoot. Therefore, I assumed it was intended. I play the game how it is presented to me, therefore I am legit.

I honestly have no idea where you people who are saying that it's not a glitch are coming from. It says plainly when you fail a clean slate with a white scroll that "since the white scroll was used, the item's upgrade slots remained intact." Well, no, the the item's upgrade slots did not remain intact, they increased by one. If that isn't enough, white scrolls were created before clean slates, cold protection, and spikes scrolls came out, meaning from a programming standpoint, it's easier to program the scroll to add a slot upon failure rather than actually "protecting" the item as both would achieve the same effect before the introduction of scrolls that did not take away a slot upon failure. Also, these new scrolls originated in kMS, which does not have white scrolls and thus would not have had this problem.

Ah, I see. Now you have somewhat convinced me that it is a glitch, simply by pointing out where it was not intended. However, by your logic:

I can call HP Washing is a glitch, simply because they did not address it at all. They did not say anywhere on the AP Resets that by putting in HP, you could pull out MP and vice versa. They simply left it in as a feature.

In a similar way, the white scroll does not say that it is limited to usage only with normal or dark scrolls. It merely mentions the two.

I'd sooner agree with you that the HP Washing is a glitch than the scrolling is intentional, because it's abnormal that of all stats, only HP and MP would be conjoined in such a way that tampering with one lets you modify both/either. Could easily settle it by asking NXProse whether or not it's functioning as designed or being exploited in his next open Q&A, or even submit a ticket really.

As for the not addressing bit - It's already been pointed out that these scrolls come from versions of MS where the other piece didn't exist. Their original creators wouldn't have made provisions for something that wasn't possible in thier native environment. Just as GMS says every time they do a patch "New content has to mesh well with our version, and since we have unique content, there's always a possibility that it could affect another area of the game, so we have to test it". This meets all the criteria for being one of those things they failed to test - disparate content interaction.

This too can be addressed via ticket or posing a question.

Tangential to the topic overall, not Harry - It's rather ridiculous for the community overall to bicker internally over something none of us has final say over the legitimacy of, especially to the degree some people are.

personally i don't see it as a glitch but more as an exploit which is also against the TOS

its an unintended outcome because of a conflict of items that were not taken into account prior to release

great why did some1 has to come up with this now when I just blew all my mesos. I really would like to +7 my spear instead of +6 0slot.. Maybe I should temp sell another equip to do this while it works. Could any1 give me an estimate of how much these 1% / 3% clean slate scrolls + white scrolls cost in Scania? Maybe it would be worth losing out a 1-2att on glove to get 5att/3str more from spear. =o


edit; wonder how some1 found out about this though. I mean its not like its smart to try out a 3% clean slate with a white scroll I wonder why they did this.

wonder how some1 found out about this though. I mean its not like its smart to try out a 3% clean slate with a white scroll I wonder why they did this.

The guy was playing maple under a blue apple tree, and when the blue apple dropped, the idea came to him.

PS: NEVER sit under a maple tree, you just dont know if some random shadowers hit you while assaulting a falling leave.

Also, keeping track of how many attacks per minute is just huge. The cost needed to count every characters on a server makes it not feasible.

Is it any worse than the cost to the server of having to keep track of the hp of a monster decreasing every 0.1 seconds? How about keeping track of player's total mesos when hackers use the no-delay looting to pick up dozens of mesos at once?
Banning or blocking people who cheat should be a priority, not keeping the server costs down but bumping them up by letting cheaters abuse the client.


And if they enforced it at, say, no more than 20% excess per minute, then it would take away the ability to cheat at bosses. Why use no delay when it gives you 10 extra crushers per minute, but you have to carefully count to make sure you never do too many?