Not 100 percent sure if this will happen but

so no decay but they can level as you use it?

psh easiest fix ever is to just give us free fusion(except maybe that S rank pomegranate) and make boxes drop more, most fair way ever

Just make the drop rate of the neb boxes what it was after the first nerf. The second nerf was ridiculous (the last box I found was in November last year)

The whole "unstable" factor still seems stupid to me.

LF> ability to add and remove nebs on sealed items

[MENTION=10688]Tyler[/MENTION] A few responses to the latest update:

-I think there's nothing wrong with how the current nebulite system affects the economy. Why do you think there's a problem with it?
-The current nebs will remain in the game but will surely deflate in value. How's that a good thing?
-What bleve said above.
-What about those players who play only a few hours a week, or maybe just 10 or so hours a week, because you know, life calls? They won't be able to take advantage of this system at all...
-I find it a tedious task to bridge the gap between the rich and the poor; and while this may do so in the area of nebulites, the way that regular cubing works will still leave a huge gap. While this may add an uncomplicated option to ultimately gain at least 15-20k (?) range for every player, the gap in damage range will remain the same because of regular potential (or even increase). In addition, the above obstacles may arguably make it even less fair for certain people than it currently is.
-I just browsed quickly through your latest changes but it seems like absolutely no NX is involved for this proposed system. That's definitely a plus at least.

[MENTION=10688]Tyler[/MENTION] A few responses to the latest update:

-I think there's nothing wrong with how the current nebulite system affects the economy. Why do you think there's a problem with it?
-The current nebs will remain in the game but will surely deflate in value. How's that a good thing?
-What bleve said above.
-What about those players who play only a few hours a week, or maybe just 10 or so hours a week, because you know, life calls? They won't be able to take advantage of this system at all...
-I find it a tedious task to bridge the gap between the rich and the poor; and while this may do so in the area of nebulites, the way that regular cubing works will still leave a huge gap. While this may add an uncomplicated option to ultimately gain at least 15-20k (?) range for every player, the gap in damage range will remain the same because of regular potential (or even increase). In addition, the above obstacles may arguably make it even less fair for certain people than it currently is.
-I just browsed quickly through your latest changes but it seems like absolutely no NX is involved for this proposed system. That's definitely a plus at least.

When I asked a group of about 100 maplers from different worlds (majority from Windia and Bera), 81/100 agreed that the current state of nebulites in regard to the economy is broken. In most worlds, even purchasing a nebulite box can cost between 5-10mil and still give a completely useless nebulite. As the drop rate decreased dramatically like @Captain Wax mentioned, realistically the largest group profiting from nebulite boxes are botters. If most of us don't see a single box for months yet dozens are appearing in the Free Market, that's a monopoly which isn't healthy for an economy.

By adding this system, normal players can at least be able to get [D] nebulites without breaking the bank which is only fair. Players with expensive nebulites aren't going to be effected too greatly as players that wish to fund their characters are still going to buy them to get the instant satisfaction. For example, someone rushing to 200 would much rather buy an A nebulite then have to wait for their nebulite to level up to A. It's merely convenience now, instead of completely hindering players.

-

Why would players who only play for a couple hours benefit from this? The drop rate for fragments will be only slightly less then anniversary boxes, which do drop at a decent rate. If a player is dedicated, they will be able to get twenty fragments before even an hour or two is up. You shouldn't disagree when events usually require multiple turn-ins or days before getting an item, this is an instant reward so nothing to complain about.

-

There is no such thing as magic (except in MMORPGs). This system's focus isn't at bridging the gap between the rich and poor but it at least does something. You can't expect perfection from me, Nexon, or anyone.

-

-I just browsed quickly through your latest changes but it seems like absolutely no NX is involved for this proposed system. That's definitely a plus at least.
There are Solar Nebulite Pouches, although it's merely to hold more nebulites. A normal nebulite pouch will be added as well and obtainable from events, Hot Time, etc.

Thanks for your input by the way.

so no decay but they can level as you use it?

Exactly. If you purchase a D nebulite, after using it training like a Timeless equip, it will slowly increase it's rank (although takes time).

Botters still win under this system. They have dozens of accounts to do this on.

I like the revamped version you posted Tyler. The nebulite pouch is a very nice touch that I am definitely in favor for (I'm constantly fusing nebulites left and right and have to stop and fuse in order to make room when opening boxes). The ranking up thing similar to timeless gear seems like a nice touch as well, though I don't think it'll get implemented. But maybe if you have to talk to Bo to upgrade it when it's ready, have him give you a quest where you have to obtain materials, and depending on the rank up will determine how much of a material someone has to get (make these items quest only items as well so people don't take the lazy way out and just buy the items from FM or other players...just to give it more of a "work for your upgrade" feel).

I also think there should be an option to remove the nebulite from a piece of equipment without needing NX. Maybe make diffusers an NPC item where the nebulite gets destroyed, but if you want to remove the nebulite and preserve it, add a special diffuser in the CS for how much the current diffusers sell for (500 NX).

With that, I'm thinking stop the leveling up of the nebs at A rank, and then have the only way to obtain an S rank nebulite is to fuse a certain amount of A nebulites together (like 5 A nebulites) but have it be guaranteed that you'll get an S rank neb. I'm just spitballing other ideas that could work...feel free to tweak them or shoot them down if you want lol.

I like the revamped version you posted Tyler. The nebulite pouch is a very nice touch that I am definitely in favor for (I'm constantly fusing nebulites left and right and have to stop and fuse in order to make room when opening boxes). The ranking up thing similar to timeless gear seems like a nice touch as well, though I don't think it'll get implemented. But maybe if you have to talk to Bo to upgrade it when it's ready, have him give you a quest where you have to obtain materials, and depending on the rank up will determine how much of a material someone has to get (make these items quest only items as well so people don't take the lazy way out and just buy the items from FM or other players...just to give it more of a "work for your upgrade" feel).

I also think there should be an option to remove the nebulite from a piece of equipment without needing NX. Maybe make diffusers an NPC item where the nebulite gets destroyed, but if you want to remove the nebulite and preserve it, add a special diffuser in the CS for how much the current diffusers sell for (500 NX).

With that, I'm thinking stop the leveling up of the nebs at A rank, and then have the only way to obtain an S rank nebulite is to fuse a certain amount of A nebulites together (like 5 A nebulites) but have it be guaranteed that you'll get an S rank neb. I'm just spitballing other ideas that could work...feel free to tweak them or shoot them down if you want lol.

I love the idea about quests and making any related items quest-items, great idea. Also, will try to work the Nebulite Diffusers into the system, shouldn't be too difficult as the original project already made them NPC purchasable instead of from the Cash Shop.

The only issue with your final suggestion is that the only way a nebulite is able to level up (from D-B) is by having it attached to an item. If players were required to then purchase four additional nebulites it would cause a supply / demand issue, as well as requiring players who originally could not afford to buy an A nebulite to purchase 4! This could be added but it would be counter-productive to the equality system. Maybe work that idea out a bit?

Great ideas, and appreciate the quest idea. If it's incorporated will start adding a contributions section.

Botters still win under this system. They have dozens of accounts to do this on.

Don't you know? The botters always win.

Botters still win under this system. They have dozens of accounts to do this on.

There are two matters that give botters an advantage. Attacking a full map to obtain items easier, and usually godmode.

With this system, it would not give them any advantage over others besides time. Sure, a botter may be able to collect all twenty nebulites in an hour where it may take a normal player an hour and a half to two, but they are still only able to produce two nebulites per character. A normal player can just switch characters and continue on getting nebulites.

If that wasn't in place, then it would be much, much worse. Would you rather a botting character to produce two nebulites or a couple hundred.

There are two matters that give botters an advantage. Attacking a full map to obtain items easier, and usually godmode.

With this system, it would not give them any advantage over others besides time. Sure, a botter may be able to collect all twenty nebulites in an hour where it may take a normal player an hour and a half to two, but they are still only able to produce two nebulites per character. A normal player can just switch characters and continue on getting nebulites.

If that wasn't in place, then it would be much, much worse. Would you rather a botting character to produce two nebulites or a couple hundred.

Don't you know? The botters always win.

It would be worth their time to bot for something else, they're not going to gain much from botting this as it limits the amount of nebulites obtainable per character.

but if you want to remove the nebulite and preserve it, add a special diffuser in the CS for how much the current diffusers sell for (500 NX).

I'd say jack this up to like 5k even. People have wasted tons of good Nebulites on terrible items so being able to recover them would be very profitable, even if you have to invest a bit of NX to do it.

I'd say jack this up to like 5k even. People have wasted tons of good Nebulites on terrible items so being able to recover them would be very profitable, even if you have to invest a bit of NX to do it.

500 is a bit low compared to the price of "good" nebulites. I'll ask what they think later.

When I asked a group of about 100 maplers from different worlds (majority from Windia and Bera), 81/100 agreed that the current state of nebulites in regard to the economy is broken. In most worlds, even purchasing a nebulite box can cost between 5-10mil and still give a completely useless nebulite. As the drop rate decreased dramatically like @Captain Wax mentioned, realistically the largest group profiting from nebulite boxes are botters. If most of us don't see a single box for months yet dozens are appearing in the Free Market, that's a monopoly which isn't healthy for an economy.

Agreed, but this could have been prevented if nexon simply chose to give out 10 nebulites to an account per week (with certain restrictions in place of course, like say your highest-lvl character must be over level 60, and account must be over a few months old, etc.), for example, instead of making it droppable from the get-go. Botters would have no leverage then. A tiny tweak to the nebulite system like that, I think, would prevent botters from using nebulites to have adverse affects on the game's economy; more so than changing the nebulite system inside and out like you're proposing.

An actual good affect of the current nebulite system on the economy is that B or A rank nebs can be used within collateral trades including items worth more than maximum mesos. I've done this myself a few times and it has worked wonders in scam prevention and alleviated the hassles of large trades. In GAZED at least, I think crappy A rank nebs usually go for 1 bil mesos. It's value stability is great for inclusion within trades.

I can also actually argue that if this system makes nebs (or fragments) droppable they'll still be abused by botters; maybe even more so than nebulite boxes dropping now are abused by botters.

By adding this system, normal players can at least be able to get [D] nebulites without breaking the bank which is only fair. Players with expensive nebulites aren't going to be effected too greatly as players that wish to fund their characters are still going to buy them to get the instant satisfaction. For example, someone rushing to 200 would much rather buy an A nebulite then have to wait for their nebulite to level up to A. It's merely convenience now, instead of completely hindering players.

I guess so. But with the way the present neb system has been spoonfed to the players, leveling a nebulite like a timeless equip seems a bit tedious by comparison.

Why would players who only play for a couple hours benefit from this? The drop rate for fragments will be only slightly less then anniversary boxes, which do drop at a decent rate. If a player is dedicated, they will be able to get twenty fragments before even an hour or two is up. You shouldn't disagree when events usually require multiple turn-ins or days before getting an item, this is an instant reward so nothing to complain about.

But if fragments drop at the same rate as anniversary boxes do, botters will have even more of a field day with this proposed neb system than with how it is now; thereby the monopoly you speak of can only get worse. No?

There is no such thing as magic (except in MMORPGs). This system's focus isn't at bridging the gap between the rich and poor but it at least does something. You can't expect perfection from me, Nexon, or anyone.

Fair game. But let's just be sure this system makes things better for the casual-to-supercommitted (non-cheating) players instead of worse before skipping to conclusions.

-I just browsed quickly through your latest changes but it seems like absolutely no NX is involved for this proposed system. That's definitely a plus at least.
There are Solar Nebulite Pouches, although it's merely to hold more nebulites. A normal nebulite pouch will be added as well and obtainable from events, Hot Time, etc.

*shrugs shoulders* Ok I guess.

Thanks for your input by the way.

Np, thanks for introducing the idea.

Edit: was ninja'd on a few points I was trying to make haha.

Agreed, but this could have been prevented if nexon simply chose to give out 10 nebulites to an account per week (with certain restrictions in place of course, like say your highest-lvl character must be over level 60, and account must be over a few months old, etc.), for example, instead of making it droppable from the get-go. Botters would have no leverage then. A tiny tweak to the nebulite system like that, I think, would prevent botters from using nebulites to have adverse affects on the game's economy; more so than changing the nebulite system inside and out like you're proposing.

Eh true, there's a lot Nexon could have done better on but what's done is done. The best you can do is try to improve upon it.

An actual good affect of the current nebulite system on the economy is that B or A rank nebs can be used within collateral trades including items worth more than maximum mesos. I've done this myself a few times and it has worked wonders in scam prevention and alleviated the hassles of large trades. In GAZED at least, I think crappy A rank nebs usually go for 1 bil mesos. It's value stability is great for inclusion within trades.

Very true. As this system doesn't alter the chances of getting A/B nebulites (except for now a chance at bosses), the price shouldn't fluctuate too dramatically.

I can also actually argue that if this system makes nebs (or fragments) droppable they'll still be abused by botters; maybe even more so than nebulite boxes dropping now are abused by botters.

I've seen some "botter shops" have an average of twenty to thirty nebulite boxes a day, so I'm [B]hoping this will be better.[/B]

I guess so. But with the way the present neb system has been spoonfed to the players, leveling a nebulite like a timeless equip seems a bit tedious by comparison.

It will be made kind of like how normal leveling is, the first couple levels are generally easier, although as you approach higher levels it'll take much longer to level a nebulite up. I'm not sure on estimated time, but leveling an A nebulite to S will have to be tedious.

But if fragments drop at the same rate as anniversary boxes do, botters will have even more of a field day with this proposed neb system than with how it is now; thereby the monopoly you speak of can only get worse. No?

Same as above, nebulite boxes currently allow for as many stacks as a botter can hold meaning if they find more then two, they're already causing more harm. This system basically effectively keeps a healthy limit of two nebulites per character, so even if someone has several accounts botting, they're only going to 2 nebulites x accounts, instead of worse.. 2+ nebulites x accounts.

Fair game. But let's just be sure this system makes things better for the casual-to-supercommitted (non-cheating) players instead of worse before skipping to conclusions.

If this gets remotely close to being added, I'm sure the Maple Team will work that out.

*shrugs shoulders* Ok I guess.

At least that way it's not really too much of an advantage, only heavy-fusing players will buy them.

Edit: was ninja'd on a few points I was trying to make haha.

There are two matters that give botters an advantage. Attacking a full map to obtain items easier, and usually godmode.

With this system, it would not give them any advantage over others besides time. Sure, a botter may be able to collect all twenty nebulites in an hour where it may take a normal player an hour and a half to two, but they are still only able to produce two nebulites per character. A normal player can just switch characters and continue on getting nebulites.

If that wasn't in place, then it would be much, much worse. Would you rather a botting character to produce two nebulites or a couple hundred.

You're giving some botters over 2x50 boxes a day though. They have multiple bots running at once.

Nebulites should of course be made available, just maybe not through monster drops.

You're giving some botters over 2x50 boxes a day though. They have multiple bots running at once.

Nebulites should of course be made available, just maybe not through monster drops.

Would you rather there be 600 nebulites introduced into the economy from botting, or 100?