Math Time

Here's a quick question.

An Outlaw does exactly 5k damage max with one bullet of maxed Burst Fire, and a Hermit does exactly 5.5k damage max with one star of Lucky Seven. Burst Fire hits three times, and Lucky Seven hits four times.

Who does more damage in one second, assuming no other skills are used?

1. Your initial thoughts?

 More info here

Burst Fire is 210% and hits 3 times. Outlaws have 54% ".9*mastery." You can assume no STR. It takes 690 milliseconds to shoot once.
Lucky Seven (+SP) is 150% with a 50% chance to proc critical for 250%, hits twice, and each star is trailed by a shadow star that does exactly half damage of the real star. Hermits have 50% ".9*mastery." It takes 600 milliseconds to attack once.

2. Did you do the math? Did you change your answer?

 Answer

They are almost dead even.

The 5k represents 210% of the Outlaw's max damage. Average base damage is 77% of 1/210% of that, or 1833. 630% of 1833 divided by .69 seconds is 16,736.

The 5.5k represents 250% of the Hermit's max damage. Average base damage is 75% of 1/250% of that, or 1650. L7+SP comes out to do 200% per star on average, or 400%, times 1.5 = 600%. 600% of 1650 divided by .6 seconds is 16,500.

I made this thread because some people don't understand the concept of "average damage." They just look at big pink numbers and multiply.

I believe you were aiming for Rubik's cube and not the Pits?

I believe you were aiming for Rubik's cube and not the Pits?

Possibly. Oops. Edit: Thanks.

Yeah I don't understand the logic of people who use "I am better than you" math. I even found out one of my adversaries was trying to outrageously trump my bossing times using an apple run. Excuse me? I usually don't waste apples at Pap or Pianus, of course I'm going to lose.

Another telling figure... if they both have 100 total atk, then the Hermit has 440 luk, the Outlaw has 660 dex. (this is assuming those are 0def damages, which otherwise min damage would be difference since they have different skill %s)

Here's a quick question.

An Outlaw does exactly 5k damage max with one bullet of maxed Burst Fire, and a Hermit does exactly 5.5k damage max with one star of Lucky Seven. Burst Fire hits three times, and Lucky Seven hits four [huh?] times.

Who does more damage in one second, assuming no other skills are used?

1. Your initial thoughts?

 More info here

Burst Fire is 210% and hits 3 times. Outlaws have 54% ".9*mastery." You can assume no STR. It takes 690 milliseconds to shoot once.
Lucky Seven (+SP) is 150% with a 50% chance to proc critical for 250%, hits twice, and each star is trailed by a shadow star that does exactly half damage of the real star. Hermits have 50% ".9*mastery." It takes 600 milliseconds to attack once.

Basically, the mastery for Outlaws is 0.54*0.9, and for hermits 0.6*0.9?
Then, I'd do the following:

Find the average damage:
(max + min) / 2
(5000 + 5000 * 0.54 * 0.9) /2
2500*(1 + 0.54 * 0.9) - outlaw

Proceed by already solved equation:
2750 * (1 + 0.6 * 0.9) - hermit
More damage per star than outlaw.

These are the average damages per strike. Now, given that hermits have 2 hits (yes, no other skills involved, as stated), they have the following average damage per attack:

2 * 2750 * (1 + 0.6 * 0.9) =
5500 * (1 + 0.6 * 0.9)

Outlaw has:
2500 * 3 * (1 + 0.54 * 0.9) =
7500 * (1 + 0.54 * 0.9)

Then, we find the average damage per second:

Outlaw: 7500 * (1 + 0,54 * 0,9) / 0,690 = 16000
Hermit: 5500 * (1 + 0,6 * 0,9) / 0,600 = 14000

Outlaw wins.

hey, I assumed no other skills, right?

Basically, the mastery for Outlaws is 0.54*0.9, and for hermits 0.6*0.9?
Then, I'd do the following:

Find the average damage:
(max + min) / 2
(5000 + 5000 * 0.54 * 0.9) /2
2500*(1 + 0.54 * 0.9) - outlaw

Proceed by already solved equation:
2750 * (1 + 0.6 * 0.9) - hermit
More damage per star than outlaw.

These are the average damages per strike. Now, given that hermits have 2 hits (yes, no other skills involved, as stated), they have the following average damage per attack:

2 * 2750 * (1 + 0.6 * 0.9) =
5500 * (1 + 0.6 * 0.9)

Outlaw has:
2500 * 3 * (1 + 0.54 * 0.9) =
7500 * (1 + 0.54 * 0.9)

Then, we find the average damage per second:

Outlaw: 7500 * (1 + 0,54 * 0,9) / 0,690 = 16000
Hermit: 5500 * (1 + 0,6 * 0,9) / 0,600 = 14000

Outlaw wins.

hey, I assumed no other skills, right?

Okay, buffs are included into the skill 0_0

And Outlaws have .54 mastery, Hermits have .50. Not sure how you got what you did.

Okay, buffs are included into the skill 0_0

And Outlaws have .54 mastery, Hermits have .50. Not sure how you got what you did.

I was quite sure lowest possible damage for hermits were 0.6 * 0.9, due to mastery. I'm not sure how you got what you did. For Outlaws, I copied your multiplier, because I don't know Pirates.

Lucky Sevens:
Minimum: (2.5 * LUK) * WA / 100 * Skill%
Maximum: (5.0 * LUK) * WA / 100 * Skill%

Mastery has no affect on L7 or TT damage, only Drain, Avenger, regular throws, Ninja Storm I believe, and possibly Taunt.

I was quite sure lowest possible damage for hermits were 0.6 * 0.9, due to mastery. I'm not sure how you got what you did. For Outlaws, I copied your multiplier, because I don't know Pirates.

Like JoeTang said, L7 and TT don't have the .9 multiplier, so it's ALWAYS 50% mastery. Outlaws have 60%*0.9 Mastery, which comes out to 54%.

im soooo confussed *grabs head in total confussion*

Lucky Sevens:
Minimum: (2.5 * LUK) * WA / 100 * Skill%
Maximum: (5.0 * LUK) * WA / 100 * Skill%

Mastery has no affect on L7 or TT damage, only Drain, Avenger, regular throws, Ninja Storm I believe, and possibly Taunt.

Ah, that explains it. Thanks for the input.

[spoiler=fix'd]
Outlaw: 7500 * (1 + 0,6 * 0,9) / 0,690 =16750
Hermit: 5500 * (1 + 0,5) / 0,600 = 13750
[/spoiler]

I believe you were aiming for Rubik's cube and not the Pits?

Could've been the Pits. From his response, though, I guess not.

Edit: Heh whoops, sorry for 5-day bump. It was still on the first page of the subforum, so I posted without looking...