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+--- Thread: Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? (/showthread.php?tid=5459)
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - MysticHLE - 2008-11-19
Don't think this was ever brought up...but I've started to think that the KB effects of these monsters are left as is intentionally...and no, I don't mean Nexon was too lazy and intentionally decided not to fix it.
But the idea came to my mind that perhaps Nexon wanted us to abuse the fact that these monsters are "invisible" immediately after the initial KB to allow lower leveled dare-daring players to proceed through CWK. It is possible to walk through the monster unharmed right after the glitched KB...given the nature of CWK and the fact that BF and Elder Wraiths spawn in many low leveled maps...perhaps this "glitch" that we all perceived it to be was actually a design purpose?
The theory in having Guardians have glitched KB...*might* point to the possibility of the fact that they want to allow everyone to explore the inner keeps as well...
Discuss...
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - KajitiSouls - 2008-11-19
I'd like to see someone actually walk through them while KBed and not get touched for damage >_>
What kind of messed up design decision is that anyways?
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - MysticHLE - 2008-11-19
Actually, I have done that for Big Foot.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - DrRusty - 2008-11-19
I refuse to believe they did that on purpose.
And you're forgetting fire brands and wolf spiders. It's pineappleing annoying training at wolf spiders when they go invincible. It's also the reason I die at bigfoot on my shadower. The fucking invincible animation is always what lets him get that split second run on me.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - Serene - 2008-11-19
KajitiSouls Wrote:I'd like to see someone actually walk through them while KBed and not get touched for damage >_>
What kind of messed up design decision is that anyways?
[COLOR="DeepSkyBlue"][SIZE="1"]its nexon for 1 lol. being messed up comes natural to them
as for gaurdian kb it dosent seems like its glitched o.o i get touch dmg either way[/SIZE][/COLOR]
as for gaurdian kb it dosent seems like its glitched o.o i get touch dmg either way[/SIZE][/COLOR]
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - KajitiSouls - 2008-11-19
MysticHLE Wrote:Actually, I have done that for Big Foot.
That's gutsy =P
Regardless, I still think that's part of Nexon being shoddy with their work. Since your rationale is that the place is meant to be explored, I would like to point out that whatever is in the Crimsonwood Keep is only going to be stronger.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - MysticHLE - 2008-11-19
Serene Wrote:[COLOR="DeepSkyBlue"][SIZE="1"]its nexon for 1 lol. being messed up comes natural to them
as for gaurdian kb it dosent seems like its glitched o.o i get touch dmg either way[/SIZE][/COLOR]
It just doesn't make sense from a programming perspective though. When you create a new monster, such properties like KB, HP, etc, should all be based on a preexisting class type. It just doesn't make sense to have a select few mobs "glitched" up and only in 1 aspect if you get a programming "bug" like that.
Not too sure on Guardian's touch damage, but I do know that their KB is delayed from the initial hit animation. Try it, they flinch about 1 second after you initially hit them.
Also, the Wolf Spider thing is a bit different from the rest of the CWK KB glitches.
KajitiSouls Wrote:That's gutsy =P
Regardless, I still think that's part of Nexon being shoddy with their work. Since your rationale is that the place is meant to be explored, I would like to point out that whatever is in the Crimsonwood Keep is only going to be stronger.
Well, with 13.2k HP on my Paladin...nothing to lose to try it out, right?
We have no proof of whatever in CWK is going to be stronger. Hell I never saw Leprechauns coming...level 45 stationary monster that drops Steelies and have no apparent attacks (despite what Fiel showed in the data)?
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - CommanderJinn - 2008-11-19
well it might also be that 'strategy element' that NxProse talked about. To be able to deal with glitched kb without taking a hit.
Nexon still failed at that though -_-
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - KajitiSouls - 2008-11-19
MysticHLE Wrote:It just doesn't make sense from a programming perspective though. When you create a new monster, such properties like KB, HP, etc, should all be based on a preexisting class type. It just doesn't make sense to have a select few mobs "glitched" up and only in 1 aspect if you get a programming "bug" like that.
Well, with 13.2k HP on my Paladin...nothing to lose to try it out, right?
We have no proof of whatever in CWK is going to be stronger. Hell I never saw Leprechauns coming...level 45 stationary monster that drops Steelies and have no apparent attacks (despite what Fiel showed in the data)?
My Paladin is only breaking 9k HP, so I have quite a bit to lose xD
From the programming perspective, the mobs usually only have one image for KB frames. It's very possible imo for Nexon to forget about programming in the collision data for the next KB images and such, although I have no idea how they interface with the data files...
As for proof of whatever in CwK is going to be stronger... this is mostly evidence from storyline and such. Actually, knowing that Crimson Guardians are actually golems and not living creatures is enough to point out that there's a stronger force at work behind the scenes. As for the story itself, the suggestion is that the original force that overthrew CwK in its glory years is related to the Versalians who are taking up residence in the present-day CwK. The "Alchemist" as we know him definitely showed up in the past, directing his corrupted hoards of Krakians to destroy CwK. And it wouldn't be a surprise if he was the reason behind all of the corrupt art that the current CwK Masters (there's 4 of them) have been practicing in their soldiers and the Phantom Forest itself. Don't forget that he practically screwed up two significant lovers (LeFay and I forget who the other guy was) of CwK permanently, both of whom have became the Headless Horseman.
EDIT: Also, in a typical "swords and magic" stronghold situation, you would want to throw your minions and underlings out in front of the enemy to wear them down, so you'd have the advantage when facing potentially dangerous opponents =P This applies for any level of a caste system.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - Stereo - 2008-11-19
Everything in CWK has ridiculously slow KB times because of what Nexon did.
Instead of the normal method:
1 KB frame, lasts 60ms
They have
2 KB frames (first is standing, second is "flinch"), each last 600ms
So it takes 20 times as long to recover as normal monsters. During this entire time it is impossible to knockback them (and in cases where the Flinch animation is missing a hitbox, impossible to damage them for half the time).
Guardians are not missing a hitbox during flinch, you can still attack them :x
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - Izzy - 2008-11-19
MysticHLE Wrote:Actually, I have done that for Big Foot.
Thats how i get past bigfoot also, usually accompanied by a bunch of frantic yelling "run forrest ruuuun"
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - alwzn4vr - 2008-11-19
I doubt Nexon had the foresight to do this. Look how the messed up the autoban with this KB animation delay.
On the other hand, we could make an event out of this. Does anyone remember the 'escort the lowest level player possible to cursed santuary' ?
We could have an 'escort the noob to the jump quest stage' event.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - Takebacker - 2008-11-19
My thought was just that they made the KB animation longer so as to make fighting monsters much easier, but they forgot the hitbox.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - Mark - 2008-11-19
Anyone who truly believed Nexon intended for them to be buggy and annoying like this is an idiot. They just don't know how to implement their own shi't and are too lazy to fix it.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - IsaacGS - 2008-11-20
It doesn't seem to have been pointed out in this thread, but there is a monster which has frames without hitboxes where it's completely intentional, and it's in Masteria:
It's called Glutton Ghoul.
How do I know the Glutton Ghoul's missing hitboxes are intentional? Because, Glutton ghoul fades in and out of view, turning invisible. When it's invisible, it can't be hit. If they were to do it this way with this monster, why not all the monsters they make? They don't have to turn invisible; just some sort of visual cue to let you know that the monster can't be attacked. Using this logic, they clearly didn't do it on purpose for all these monsters. Not to mention all the other glitched aspects of said monsters (Missing boss flag on bigfoot, ridiculous size changes in the hitbox on Firebrands, names not disappearing, etc.). It's pretty clear this is a mistake.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - FelixTM - 2008-11-20
IsaacGS Wrote:It doesn't seem to have been pointed out in this thread, but there is a monster which has frames without hitboxes where it's completely intentional, and it's in Masteria:
It's called Glutton Ghoul.
How do I know the Glutton Ghoul's missing hitboxes are intentional? Because, Glutton ghoul fades in and out of view, turning invisible. When it's invisible, it can't be hit. If they were to do it this way with this monster, why not all the monsters they make? They don't have to turn invisible; just some sort of visual cue to let you know that the monster can't be attacked. Using this logic, they clearly didn't do it on purpose for all these monsters. Not to mention all the other glitched aspects of said monsters (Missing boss flag on bigfoot, ridiculous size changes in the hitbox on Firebrands, names not disappearing, etc.). It's pretty clear this is a mistake.
Exactly the argument I presented when this discussion first came up, quite some time ago. Anyone remember what thread that was in? I'm sure it would be enough to /thread this one.
This was absolutely not intentional. I thought this debate was settled.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - modular - 2008-11-20
remember the showa patch? extra d had some frames missing a hitbox. nexon fixed her.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - Combattente - 2008-11-20
I think this wasn't intentional and it's undoubtedly a bug.
BUT, you know, NEXON takes ages to fix minor bugs. They focus on major bugs and new content only.
An example? Ariant NPCs descriptions. You know, under every NPC name there's the NPC's description. For example, "Grocer". Now, not only some Ariant NPCs have weird dots after the description (ex. "Skin care master."), and they usually shouldn't have them, but some of them doesn't are different than normal. For example, instead of "Storage Keeper" or whatever the storage NPCs' description is, the Ariant Storage NPC has the description "Warehouse Keeper". "Warehouse" and "Storage" are pretty much different.
Also, the potion seller NPC is called "General dealer" instead of "Grocer". Doesn't make much sense.
I reported this bug already when they opened Tespia for Ariant, and I tested it.
Did they fix it? Undoubtedly not.. and that's from patch 0.56 (or whatever patch Ariant got released).
Well, maybe the missing hitboxes may not be a MINOR bug for you, but I guess for NEXON it is.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - KajitiSouls - 2008-11-20
"General Dealer" is a valid name for a potion shop NPC. I don't think this really merits much attention at all.
Guardians, BF, Elder Wraiths' "glitched" KB intentional? - Steveio - 2008-11-20
Don't forget how one of the doctors in Ariant is a Palstic Surgeon.