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+--- Thread: [Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. (/showthread.php?tid=74864)
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - jakbeer - 2015-08-11
when you say legit, it is a person who bosses, and does merchanting. They have the right to keep their mesos unless it would be turned into real currency or NX. They can buy godly gears, or some sort assuming they are legit. New classes (Kinesis) is coming out soon and we need %INT. Mesos decaying sounds ridiculous because we players have decisions on which class or fund, or simply sleep on things while we do have lives.
Also a thing people can do aside from grinding and bossing is crafting (Dominator Pendants sound old.) We know Gollux left Arkarium's Dominator Pendant in the dust, but it mentioned it was a Legendary Pendant. Those who are aware of the Arkarium rings may have know they have a meister counterpart. If Arkarium's Pendant has a meister counterpart, it can stand up Gollux. Assuming its materials aren't too easy or hard to find, the pendant can we awarded not from overpowered range from killing bosses but rather from crafting and harvesting. Another way to keep players motivated and feel pride once they achieve the pendant is to make the materials items untradable like Lunar Lew as well as make it untradable upon crafting. This would be a sign of a player's dedicated rather than wallet put into the game.
A reason we don't have Flames is because we have Nebulites. Nebulites are used and fused but some are looked down upon due to their low rank unless they are fused. Even some A nebs are worthless. Looking at Flames, they drop from bosses quite often and can randomize an equip's stats, and add scissor counts. Since it something that randomizes and is from easy bosses, even those power hungry players would need a lot before they find their desired raw stats. Flames can boast as much power compared to our Flames, and are random so players would need to try their luck.
Players should be rewarded with powerful items by stepping aside from those endgame bosses and enjoying some less noticed content which the Developers and getting lucky from it. Items that give out guarantees will make the other items worthless even though it is guarantees (A Neb DEF is worse than B Neb stat%.) By introducing a more luck of the draw where you cannot see the result until you use it, players would want to buy more Flames from other players regardless of wealth or status.
Bad example of so called random: Opening a Neb Box which drops rarely (Random until you open the box and see its results) in which the opener can decide to use it, discard, sell, or modify via fusing.
Good Example: Finding a Flame occasionally which can reconfigure stats only when applied directly to the item (like cubes or scrolls.) Assuming low leveled players, or lower class players can afford it, they can sell it and profit, but miss a opportunity to power up/evolve or use it himself/herself and enjoy a boost while not making mesos. And these Flames are great since they are progressive according to equipment levels, unlike Nebulites where you can have sharp eyes WGs.
Theory on how using Flames on yourself
1. You fight a simple Zakum and find your first flame and power up after using. Yay!
2. You try on more Flames and power up the gears you have until you fight something tougher like HT.
3. You get the new Flames and try it on some Utgard/ Pensair Armor and power up like you did before, except stats gained are bigger.
4. You flame a your items after many bosses and get an OP stat for a low level gear, and then you make it your favorite/ endgame gear.
Just like that, a non CRA/ Empress equipment can become powerful and you are party can kill eventually kill Empress without her gear. All that party needs to do is kill bosses below Empress's power and reconfigure their items to a something good (you can stat%, PDR% or even level requirement decrease!)
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - TheBlackMage - 2015-08-11
^ Um, it doesn't work like that. And the Nebulite system is one of the worst additions to the game or at least amongst the most pointless ones.
Only true benefit that came out of it would be the fact you can run SE+DI glove way easier. It adds no value to those who are weak, Nobody in the middle can afford decent ones, and it's too little for the funded.
It surely can co-exist with flames.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - Justin - 2015-08-11
The neb system is a cash grab in almost its entirety. Only good thing about it is for se+si gloves like you mentioned, and the fact you can combine two similar ranked nebs to retry for one of more value. Otherwise nebs don't even compare to additional options by a longshot.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - jakbeer - 2015-08-11
do you feel flames should be introduced to the game since it is limited to specific gears, and can grant nice bonuses from raw numbers to %?
[video=youtube;bSLiT9kymPM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSLiT9kymPM[/video]
This is in case you don't feel like referring to Orange MUshroom's unlimited patch. And also, the video is in English
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - SaptaZapta - 2015-08-11
jakbeer Wrote:when you say legit, it is a person who bosses, and does merchanting. They have the right to keep their mesos unless it would be turned into real currency or NX. They can buy godly gears, or some sort assuming they are legit. New classes (Kinesis) is coming out soon and we need %INT. Mesos decaying sounds ridiculous because we players have decisions on which class or fund, or simply sleep on things while we do have lives.
Would you rather a one-time cut of 90% off all meso in the game?
The only reason it costs so much to get godly gears or to equip your Kinesis is because there are people who are able to offer that much.
If nobody had more than one billion meso, then nothing would cost ten or twenty billion.
If prices are ever to go down, the stockpiled meso, even though it was earned legitimately by bossing or merching, has got to be cut.
It would still leave you with more than anyone else, so you'd still be able to outbid everyone and get godly gear - but you'll be getting it for 100m instead of 10b apiece.
Isn't that better?
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - jakbeer - 2015-08-11
SaptaZapta Wrote:Would you rather a one-time cut of 90% off all meso in the game?
The only reason it costs so much to get godly gears or to equip your Kinesis is because there are people who are able to offer that much.
If nobody had more than one billion meso, then nothing would cost ten or twenty billion.
If prices are ever to go down, the stockpiled meso, even though it was earned legitimately by bossing or merching, has got to be cut.
It would still leave you with more than anyone else, so you'd still be able to outbid everyone and get godly gear - but you'll be getting it for 100m instead of 10b apiece.
Isn't that better?
So this would make mesos harder to come by since it would decay, and reaching max is harder. Items that used to be max would be less, and those items sold for max would be equal to 100B in today's market?
I seem that in KMS, a buyable 70% boss 12%, with 21% att bonused, 15% traced fafnir sold for like 7B, compared to us 40B. If it would help reduce scams on high level equips, I would support it.
But with that decision, what are your thoughts of introducing Flames?
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - cronnoponno - 2015-08-11
jakbeer Wrote:do you feel flames should be introduced to the game since it is limited to specific gears, and can grant nice bonuses from raw numbers to %?
[video=youtube;bSLiT9kymPM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSLiT9kymPM[/video]
This is in case you don't feel like referring to Orange MUshroom's unlimited patch. And also, the video is in English
If this drops from bosses and is really as accessible as the maker exlains it I think its a good start.
Also looks like you could sell them for profit as well.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - dowie - 2015-08-11
Flames / additional options were not brought to gms because the community said they didn't want it.
for SOME reason , the community on the nexon forums were up in arms about flames being bad and for some other reason Nexon decided to listen to the community.
I'm serious about this.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - Grey - 2015-08-12
dowie Wrote:for SOME reason , the community on the nexon forums were up in arms about flames being bad
The one legitimate reason would be the fact that things that are flamed become untradeable, and along with those equips, all equips over 140 have scissor limits, and when you exhaust them, they become untradeable forever. I think people also might have confused the effects of additional options with the effects of MEEs, making additional options seem like a game breaking cash grab.
You probably won't be able to flame anything that you've gotten after Unlimited, or rather, Spark here with the standard flames. I think, despite not getting additional options, they've still added in the status (white dot vs gray flame in the equip picture) that prevents items from dropping after Unlimited from being flamed with the standard flames, you can only flame them with flames gotten from events or accessory crafting.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - jakbeer - 2015-08-12
Flames drop from early on from bosses like Zakum, and the best ones are available via crafting like Meister Cubes. Nebulites are uber rare, and replacing them requires removing the old one for 500NX. Flames can be used until you say YAY! @SaptaZapta mentioned that if our mesos decayed, prices of goods would decrease. As an MLC (some people diss us) we want to balance the game to let non-paying for low funded players enjoy all the content. A low level can kill zakum, get a crazy flamed result and own Horntail, and then PB, and Empress. All they need to do is boss boss boss and keep their item's flame results at + stat% , +total dmg%, boss%, PDR%.
If we have property taxes, this can help players from descending to poverty because players would be finding them, sell their spares after they are pleased to those who are power-hungry. This will also get quick mesos for low levels and make all bosses worthwhile. If you can reconfigure stats without NX, wouldn't that be fun? We all know cubing is fickle, but is less P2W if it didn't require NX. If you are unhappy without your results, kill a boss, get a flame and re-roll.
I understand with a stationary cap, and with this combination, players would hit high, and those up their will be pretty much the same.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - dowie - 2015-08-12
Flames are great. They'd help circulate equips because as it is you can just use 1 equip and roll with it on scrolls / cubes until it's to you're liking.
Max out flame usage on an equip and its bad well then you pretty much get rid of it.
Since we really have nothing to destroy / get rid of equips the price of base equips is practically on a free level now.
What i can't understand is out of all things that the community complained about, it had to be flames. Probably was a $$$ reason to do so .
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - Grey - 2015-08-12
dowie Wrote:Flames are great. They'd help circulate equips because as it is you can just use 1 equip and roll with it on scrolls / cubes until it's to you're liking.
Max out flame usage on an equip and its bad well then you pretty much get rid of it.
Since we really have nothing to destroy / get rid of equips the price of base equips is practically on a free level now.
What i can't understand is out of all things that the community complained about, it had to be flames. Probably was a $$$ reason to do so .
You can keep flaming equips indefinitely. There's no maxing it out, you never have to get rid of equips this way either.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - Dark Link - 2015-08-12
Frankly it's extremely stupid that NexonNA didn't introduce Additional Options to GMS. It's literally free stats.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - dowie - 2015-08-12
Grey Wrote:You can keep flaming equips indefinitely. There's no maxing it out, you never have to get rid of equips this way either.
oh my bad. I must be thinking of something else.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - Silver - 2015-08-12
dowie Wrote:Flames / additional options were not brought to gms because the community said they didn't want it.
for SOME reason , the community on the nexon forums were up in arms about flames being bad and for some other reason Nexon decided to listen to the community.
I'm serious about this.
Flames (along with star force/enhancements, bonus potential, etc.) suck. Why should we have 10k ways to upgrade our gear? (exaggeration)
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - TheBlackMage - 2015-08-12
It isn't just free stats, if you'll read my post on the last page, in a way it keeps the market from being spammed with generic equips *cough* gms *cough*.
I agree with [MENTION=1747]Grey[/MENTION]; it seems like people still don't know how flames work.
And lul seems like the gms community doomed itself in a way.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - Marksman Bryan - 2015-08-12
I've tried to get randomized options on drops back with no avail, and now I will be pushing for flames and additional options to be implemented. I must say I am guilty of thinking it was a bad system back when the community was "polled" during their original release decision. Upon further research, it seems my thoughts were unfounded.
This is definitely the sort of content MLC can get implemented, so hopefully it goes over well.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - CarrionCrow - 2015-08-12
Dark Link Wrote:Frankly it's extremely stupid that NexonNA didn't introduce Additional Options to GMS. It's literally free stats.
We generally supported the exclusion, because at the time it looked like it was a smart move to limit how powerful the top tier could become.
That notion quickly turned to ash.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - SaptaZapta - 2015-08-12
I believe the objections to additional options were these:
1. It adds a (P)SoK count to equipment, which means an item loses value every time it is traded (because at some point it won't be able to be traded anymore).
2. It makes everyone way too strong. And of course the rich get the better equipment (same as they get the better nebulites in GMS), so they get stronger faster.
This objection, at least, has lost its force now that so many people are capping anyway, and Nexon is attempting to raise the floor (since they can't lower the ceiling).
However, one must consider that there is a certain segment of the heavily funded population that is already pushing for a raised damage cap (or to remove it entirely), and the closer "plebes" come to capping, the louder this segment will become.
[Rant] This game's practically dead in terms of actual content. - Grey - 2015-08-12
I think the argument that the rich get better equipment is unfounded. Additional options isn't a system that distinguishes between rich and poor. Sure, richer players can do more bosses, but that's only a marginal increase in the amount of flames they can get, especially since most of the more difficult bosses, except like, Hard Hilla and Chaos Pink Bean, are once a week rather than something they can do every day to widen the gap. Not to mention the possibility that those flames would be possibly be unhelpful anyway because those only work on equips from before additional options were a thing (you need to extract them and craft the new flames with Accessory Crafting to use them on newer equipments, so they do still have value). Being rich doesn't give you that much of an advantage over the poor, it doesn't let you spam flames infinitely more often. Being rich also doesn't mean you'll always have the best stats on your equips, either. Sure, you can buy the equips with the best additional options, but a poorer player could easily save up for a cheap, terrible additional option equip and flame that until it's good (something else which we've lost since they also got rid of stat variation as whole is price variation on equips). This is more speaking from the game as it is now, but even at the point we would've gotten it, I think it would've been quite a bit more helpful for poorer players than the rich.
I think the untradeability majorly sucks, but I think it's a necessary price, not to mention one of the major complaints at the time was from people who didn't use untradeable equips (of which I myself, was one), they didn't want them to become untradeable. As I tried to explain when we were all complaining about this, you could always just hunt new equips. If it's under level 140, it'll still be tradeable as it is now, what sucks is the cost of recubing and scrolling, but if you really want the extra stats, it's not entirely undoable.
Throwback to two years ago.