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+--- Thread: 4th job Single Target DPS (/showthread.php?tid=6564)
4th job Single Target DPS - Dusk - 2010-12-28
DustBunny Wrote:Dark knight needs some updates, though DJ essentially covered the summon, it reflects our damage range, attacks every 5 seconds. However hex isn't calculated either, which gives our class 60 weapon attack.
Hex is calculated.
Going on vacation tomorrow, no updates for a few days.
4th job Single Target DPS - dpeterlin - 2010-12-28
Dusk Wrote:Hex is calculated.
He was referring to DB and misspoke.
Hex + DB = 60 wattk for drks
4th job Single Target DPS - Devil - 2010-12-28
Uhm, I just discovered that Meso Explosion hits higher then possible without criticals... o.0
What I think what happens is, Meso Explosion -CAN- critical, but the damage isn't shown purple...
Some (only a few) hits do 20k damage per hit, while my range is like 4900~7000, and 7000 * 2.4 = 16800.
Max basic critical is +70% right? 3.1 * 7000 = 21700. So then it's possible. I have to try it out with SE if it can go even higher (+30% max critical damage).
4th job Single Target DPS - Oaysis - 2010-12-29
Wow, never knew Dark Knights were so pro at high pdrate bosses.
4th job Single Target DPS - Tamillan - 2010-12-29
K so hero is stronger than NL now that i already knew. DK is too. But why is a BM having higher dmg shown on sheet than nl >_>. That kinda makes nl a weak ranged class.
4th job Single Target DPS - Signal - 2010-12-29
Csenger did some calculations on SW about SP hits and % dmg:
http://www.sleepywood.net/forum/showpost.php?p=10323023&postcount=339
It's scary to see shads doing 1.2mil dps with pure ME while the next highest is 900k lol. With CO meso explosion gains a ridiculous dps boost due to meso mastery 10->12, and if Devil is correct expect that number to jump up.
4th job Single Target DPS - Devil - 2010-12-29
Tamillan Wrote:K so hero is stronger than NL now that i already knew. DK is too. But why is a BM having higher dmg shown on sheet than nl >_>. That kinda makes nl a weak ranged class.That's why the restructuring patch boosts them again, and PVP patch (non-pvp damage) nerfs them again a bit...
4th job Single Target DPS - Tamillan - 2010-12-29
Devil Wrote:That's why the restructuring patch boosts them again, and PVP patch (non-pvp damage) nerfs them again a bit...
i put in 293% TT instead of 250 on the sheet. Still the bm is stronger. If i put the 345% then nl comes out slightly higher or same. So idk why kmst nerfed it to 293. No point in making a nl if bm can do more dmg. why bother to give se to nl when we can just bring in all bms. NL have high avoid yes but still...
4th job Single Target DPS - Dusk - 2010-12-29
Tamillan Wrote:i put in 293% TT instead of 250 on the sheet. Still the bm is stronger. If i put the 345% then nl comes out slightly higher or same. So idk why kmst nerfed it to 293. No point in making a nl if bm can do more dmg. why bother to give se to nl when we can just bring in all bms. NL have high avoid yes but still...
Uh...SE isn't the super NL fuel skill that it was pre-BB. It just boosts everyone's damage by about 10-15%. NLs have a mobility/avoid advantage over BMs; I think it makes sense for archers to be stronger.
4th job Single Target DPS - Tamillan - 2010-12-29
Yea I know se is not much of a boost anymore. However I don't like the fact that when it comes to raw dmg BM>NL =(. Of course the avoid and shifter makes NL very good at bossing. Still seems kinda depressing. What I totaly dont get is why is a hero so high dmg. It is basically much stronger than any class except dk with gody gear lets say. No point in taking a lot of ranged classes for bossing when we can take most of the parties with heros. Of course we need a few ranged to do some ranged attacks on pb runs and stuff. However it seems that now the king of dmg is hero. DK will hit the dmg cap too easily but heros can pass that 1m per atk with a good gear. Kinda depressing for NLs like me.
4th job Single Target DPS - Devil - 2010-12-29
Tamillan Wrote:Yea I know se is not much of a boost anymore. However I don't like the fact that when it comes to raw dmg BM>NL =(. Of course the avoid and shifter makes NL very good at bossing. Still seems kinda depressing. What I totaly dont get is why is a hero so high dmg. It is basically much stronger than any class except dk with gody gear lets say. No point in taking a lot of ranged classes for bossing when we can take most of the parties with heros. Of course we need a few ranged to do some ranged attacks on pb runs and stuff. However it seems that now the king of dmg is hero. DK will hit the dmg cap too easily but heros can pass that 1m per atk with a good gear. Kinda depressing for NLs like me.So, uhm:
- NL's have better mobility (haste / flash jump / shoot in mid-air)
- NL's have better survivability (getting hit less)
- NL's are cheaper to train (less pots)
- NL's train faster (because of all the above)
Now NL's should be the strongest class also? o.0
At what part can BM's (and other classes) be best in your opinion?!? :o
4th job Single Target DPS - Tamillan - 2010-12-29
Devil Wrote:So, uhm:
- NL's have better mobility (haste / flash jump / shoot in mid-air)
- NL's have better survivability (getting hit less)
- NL's are cheaper to train (less pots)
- NL's train faster (because of all the above)
Now NL's should be the strongest class also? o.0
At what part can BM's (and other classes) be best in your opinion?!? :o
Yes your defintetely right but its not so bad that bm is a bit stronger than nl in raw dmg but the avoid of nl can push it up to the level of the bm or higher. Im a 200 NL and i boss everyday with my nl. Our alchemist, mobility, decent dmg, high avoid really makes me enjoy bossing. BM with puppet and some avoid (i think they have a 20% avoid skill or smth or am i wrong?) seem good too. But heros????? why they so high dmg. If you decide to make a godly char with superbe hp washing and gearing+cubeing. Hero can reach a superbe hp and with superbe gear it will stand out from all the classes. They should nerf the dmg definetely. Heros have no weaknesses >_>.
4th job Single Target DPS - Forte - 2010-12-29
Tell me why Heroes shouldn't have high damage. I don't see why you want your class to be consistently number 1 in terms of dps. You NLs had your era of ruling over everyone else.
NL don't really have a weakness either; they used to be plagued by low HP but with Shadow Resistance it's gone. They benefit from cubing and HP washing just as much as a hero would. They have range so they don't have to tank bosses. They save mesos with alchemist and their natural avoid.
4th job Single Target DPS - Stereo - 2010-12-29
Forte Wrote:Tell me why Heroes shouldn't have high damage. I don't see why you want your class to be consistently number 1 in terms of dps. You NLs had your era of ruling over everyone else.
I must have missed that era... NLs have never been #1 at raw DPS? They're just better at laying it down, for the reasons mentioned above (except when being swarmed by mobs, which I think is fixed by the 0-range change). They did kinda nerf avoidability, but that's about it.
You should be happy NLs aren't so reliant on SE anymore... it used to give them a better damage boost than any 4th job skill in the NL book. Now a Night Lord can solo bosses without sucking ass.
4th job Single Target DPS - Tamillan - 2010-12-30
Yes NL before big bang were really good bossers but now the big bang is here. Things should be balanced well. Heros before bb were really good till potentail equips came and then do 400k max per slash while nl hits a lot more. However now things should overall well balanced. Having hero overdmging all other classes seem unfair to the others. Im not saying to boost nl dmg really. What i want is to nerf hero dmg. Imagine a boss is blinded. heros get even more boost from that >_>. Heros can easily get high hp with hp washing and not worry about dieing too much. If a NL spends equal amount of hp washing, they wont get enough to survive as much as a hero. We stay far but not always far. Sometimes in some cases we end up getting dmg reflected by pb. All the ranged just die right there. The heros with 50k hp just tank it and continue on w/o losing apple >_>. The way they balanced most of the classes are good. Mages do some ok dmg now to bosses. However the warrior classes are just far too overpowered. A party warriors are just too strong.
4th job Single Target DPS - Cavalier - 2010-12-30
Tamillan Wrote:Yes NL before big bang were really good bossers but now the big bang is here. Things should be balanced well. Heros before bb were really good till potentail equips came and then do 400k max per slash while nl hits a lot more. However now things should overall well balanced. Having hero overdmging all other classes seem unfair to the others. Im not saying to boost nl dmg really. What i want is to nerf hero dmg. Imagine a boss is blinded. heros get even more boost from that >_>. Heros can easily get high hp with hp washing and not worry about dieing too much. If a NL spends equal amount of hp washing, they wont get enough to survive as much as a hero. We stay far but not always far. Sometimes in some cases we end up getting dmg reflected by pb. All the ranged just die right there. The heros with 50k hp just tank it and continue on w/o losing apple >_>. The way they balanced most of the classes are good. Mages do some ok dmg now to bosses. However the warrior classes are just far too overpowered. A party warriors are just too strong.
Where are you getting the idea that Heroes are outdamaging every other class?
4th job Single Target DPS - Tamillan - 2010-12-30
Huh....Im basing this totaly on dusk's sheet. I put in hero's intrepid slash as 225%. TT as 293%. the other classes i fixed the % the ones that changed. And i put in similar gears to each class. The sheet is giving me dk at top. 2nd hero. Then comes in the rest. NL is about a little higher than middle. Let me check my sheet if i changed some number by accident.
K i appled them all. Using self se for all except db.
140% primary stat. the rest all the same as dusk. I put in the 45atk bonus from weapon scrolls instead of 35. the rest are same.
50% dmg reduction.
DK:1406
Hero:1377
Paladin:1091
sair:1201
NL:1124
WH:1300
BM:1248
70% dmg reduction
dk:1406 obviosly
hero:1141
paladin:806
sair:721
nl:817
wh:953
bm:915
Unless i made some mistake. Then my results are wrong. but i think it should be right.
Lets say you decide to overfund a char. DK would hit 1m most. While hero can hit like 1b+. So hero basically outdmges the dk. Then there is no other class than outdmges hero. so its #1 O_O. the difference between nl and hero seem quite big especially at 70% pdr its like hero is 40% stronger. >_>
4th job Single Target DPS - Stereo - 2010-12-30
Intrepid Slash is only 210% (214 with CO) and TT is 250/256%, where are 225 and 293 coming from?
4th job Single Target DPS - hamad138 - 2010-12-30
i can help with mechanics what do u need to know?
120 SHots Heavy Machine gun 5Sec
Missle tank is 250ms with booster (6Shots)
What u need to know too?
4th job Single Target DPS - dpeterlin - 2010-12-30
Stereo Wrote:Intrepid Slash is only 210% (214 with CO) and TT is 250/256%, where are 225 and 293 coming from?
I believe he's trying to look at the numbers after chaos patch. Not sure if those line up properly with what he put down but he's trying to get a feel for what all the chars will eventually end up with from what I gathered.
Tamillan: Don't forget more % from shields for heroes.
~Sorry couldn't help myself.