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+---- Thread: Pokémon Black and White versions (/showthread.php?tid=24481)
Pokémon Black and White versions - MasPan - 2010-05-15
Will Wrote:Zoroark's ability really will determine how usable he'll be in the meta-game.
;_;
Hopefully its not too crappy.
Im hoping it just transforms into the closest resisting form/dog form just to tip it off, but it can go anywhere. @_@
[color="#cc8899"]OU/Uber metagame...eww. UUplz
I'm hoping for some MAJOR nerfs on Stealth Rock (50% hp damage on fly/bug switchins? Really? Ability to KO on switchin? pineapple you Stealth Rock, crippling my favorite types.[/COLOR]
Pokémon Black and White versions - Khoi - 2010-05-15
SR did make Mono-bug teams pretty useless and sh`it. That's why my best friend refuses to play Shoddy Battle and 4th gen, because he always makes Mono-Bug teams. Yes, SR can be beat by Rapid Spinning. But that's too much work, and it does x4 to Scyther and all Bug/Flying in the game. GG monobug teams. :/
Pokémon Black and White versions - MasPan - 2010-05-15
Omni Wrote:SR did make Mono-bug teams pretty useless and sh`it. That's why my best friend refuses to play Shoddy Battle and 4th gen, because he always makes Mono-Bug teams. Yes, SR can be beat by Rapid Spinning. But that's too much work, and it does x4 to Scyther and all Bug/Flying in the game. GG monobug teams. :/
I HAVE to carry 2 spinners at all times, or my poor Shedinja never gets to do anything. I hate it. It's beyond stupid, especially when every god damned team has Stealth Rock on it. Even mine. It took what used to be a useful if gimmicky mechanic and made it into "If you don't have this very likely you wont survive the metagame." It's disgusting, and I really can't fathom why Stealth Rock hasn't been limited to OU play and above.
Pokémon Black and White versions - Khoi - 2010-05-15
SR makes the metagame sorta predictable. The point of playing "Outside the box" was to come up with better ways and perhaps more effective ways to beat your opponent. While SR does both, it's very predictable. Problem here is that it eliminates fun teams such as Monos. SR is so over-used that I cringe when I see someone using SR. I made a couple teams without using SR, and I admit that though it was harder to win, it was less predictable, along with the fact that there was more of an achievement when I won.
During 3rd gen meta, SkarmBliss was everywhere. All of my friends said "Why don't you have a Rapid Spinner?", I said "Why should I?". They replied with "SkarmBliss + Spikesx3 + mass Roar = GG". I said "There are other ways to get around that". I proved it to them.
The only way to make a secure team that will beat SR would be to have either half of your team (or more) having access to Taunt and/or Rapid Spin. I recommend both, but it weakens your offense.
I remember using a strange Ttar set in the day to counter SkarmBliss. BoltBeam + Taunt + Focus Punch (predicting Skarm2Bliss switch).
Pokémon Black and White versions - MasPan - 2010-05-15
Omni Wrote:SR makes the metagame sorta predictable. The point of playing "Outside the box" was to come up with better ways and perhaps more effective ways to beat your opponent. While SR does both, it's very predictable. Problem here is that it eliminates fun teams such as Monos. SR is so over-used that I cringe when I see someone using SR. I made a couple teams without using SR, and I admit that though it was harder to win, it was less predictable, along with the fact that there was more of an achievement when I won.
During 3rd gen meta, SkarmBliss was everywhere. All of my friends said "Why don't you have a Rapid Spinner?", I said "Why should I?". They replied with "SkarmBliss + Spikesx3 + mass Roar = GG". I said "There are other ways to get around that". I proved it to them.
The only way to make a secure team that will beat SR would be to have either half of your team (or more) having access to Taunt and/or Rapid Spin. I recommend both, but it weakens your offense.
[color="#cc8899"]Problem is, while it's nice to have so much defense against SR, it's used by maybe 1 pokemon per team, so it's never really a CONSTANT threat, outside of Sandstorm teams (which outright kill Shedinja anyway). The original idea behind it was pretty obviously a more unique entry hazard, but its use has gone well beyond such. People are also very fond of switching to ghosts to counte rapid spin...I'd be interested to see other moves have the ability to remove entry hazards, or even switch-ins with an ability to remove them. Something, ANYTHING. My treasured bug types are so pineappleing crippled right now, it's painful.
I wouldn't be surprised if we see a special attack equivalent to burn this gen, and possibly stat-affecting entry hazards. Burn spikes would be very interesting, give them reduced damage, fire type, and a 33% chance of burn. It'd make Flash Fire a staple ability to have on your team to counter, so it'd be somewhat risky to use, but could be well worth it against certain attackers.
Of course, natural progression would also lead to "Spikes on entry" abilities, akin to "Weather on entry" abilities already common. I'm not particularly fond of this idea...[/COLOR]
Pokémon Black and White versions - Khoi - 2010-05-15
You're right. But SR eliminates the following Mono teams:
-Flying
-Fire
-Bug
-Ice
Which is why I think that it's crucial to have a counter Taunters and at least 1 RS'er if you can assuming you're using a mono team. Otherwise, it's not required. Hell, you can have a tank using Taunt and it will f*ck up SR. 4th gen is pretty stupid, monos aren't as fun and it's harder to pull them off because of SR. That and it stacks with Spikes and Toxic Spikes.
Personally, for 5th gen, I'd like to see something similar to SR, but instead, it's of Electric element. Imagine this. Something that lasts for the entire match, but based by percentage. If a switch-in was, let's say Water, it would do twice the amount of damage. It would also damage every turn. Similar to poison or Toxic infliction, perhaps even Burn. With a chance for Parz, but slim, like around 6%.
Pokémon Black and White versions - MasPan - 2010-05-15
Omni Wrote:You're right. But SR eliminates the following Mono teams:
-Flying
-Fire
-Bug
-Ice
Which is why I think that it's crucial to have a counter Taunters and at least 1 RS'er if you can assuming you're using a mono team. Otherwise, it's not required. Hell, you can have a tank using Taunt and it will f*ck up SR. 4th gen is pretty stupid, monos aren't as fun and it's harder to pull them off because of SR. That and it stacks with Spikes and Toxic Spikes.
Personally, for 5th gen, I'd like to see something similar to SR, but instead, it's of Electric element. Imagine this. Something that lasts for the entire match, but based by percentage. If a switch-in was, let's say Water, it would do twice the amount of damage. It would also damage every turn. Similar to poison or Toxic infliction, perhaps even Burn. With a chance for Parz, but slim, like around 6%.
[color="#cc8899"]Yea, I thought of an "electric fence" type deal, but electric already has a passive field effect - Magnet Rise.
And yea, 4th Gen UU is all about Stealth Rocking (I imagine OU is too, prob not Ubers so much). I'd just as soon have the move removed entirely rather than a similar move for each type being introduced.
I could easily see things like Gust removing hazards, maybe earthquake removing spikes/tspikes, surf removing all field hazards (DO WANT).[/COLOR]
Pokémon Black and White versions - Dusk - 2010-05-15
MasPan Wrote:[color="#cc8899"]Yea, I thought of an "electric fence" type deal, but electric already has a passive field effect - Magnet Rise.
And yea, 4th Gen UU is all about Stealth Rocking (I imagine OU is too, prob not Ubers so much). I'd just as soon have the move removed entirely rather than a similar move for each type being introduced.
I could easily see things like Gust removing hazards, maybe earthquake removing spikes/tspikes, surf removing all field hazards (DO WANT).[/COLOR]
SR is hugely present in every metagame in Gen 4 (probably even Little Cup, not so much Doubles). I agree that it needs to be nerfed.
I don't bother carrying spinners, I just play assuming that it's going to be on the field no matter what. My current lead in OU is a Lum Berry Metagross with SR / Meteor Mash / Bullet Punch / Earthquake EV'd for HP and Attack and just a little speed. Almost every game I play has SR on both sides of the field.
It probably helps that I have 4 Rock resistances on my team and no weaknesses
Pokémon Black and White versions - MasPan - 2010-05-15
Dusk Wrote:SR is hugely present in every metagame in Gen 4 (probably even Little Cup, not so much Doubles). I agree that it needs to be nerfed.
I don't bother carrying spinners, I just play assuming that it's going to be on the field no matter what. My current lead in OU is a Lum Berry Metagross with SR / Meteor Mash / Bullet Punch / Earthquake EV'd for HP and Attack and just a little speed. Almost every game I play has SR on both sides of the field.
It probably helps that I have 4 Rock resistances on my team and no weaknesses
[color="#cc8899"]That's the thing, Bug types are a huge favorite of mine and almost all of them get crushed by it, it's really annoying. Grass is also pretty common in UU, and not being able to use Fire types easily for STAB kos is pretty frustrating. I use Shedinja, so I HAVE to have spinners, or else he can't do anything before dying.
Though, I must admit, there is nothing more glorious than passing a HP EV Driblim Substitute to a Shedinja with a Focus Sash - He can tank at least 2 extra hits, so delicious, and the sub prevents Toxic.
(My Shedinja runs Shadow Sneak, X Scissor, Swords Dance, and...I can't remember the last move atm. I've actually swept with him a few times after removing his threats, and my playstyle tends to revolve around sacrificing anything necessary to safely use him).[/COLOR]
Pokémon Black and White versions - Hazzy - 2010-05-15
![[Image: 1273931283430.png]](http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5506330/images/Pokeman/1273931283430.png)
Lolsprites. Kinda interesting though.
Pokémon Black and White versions - Dusk - 2010-05-15
More likely they're just using the D/P sprites as placeholders.
Pokémon Black and White versions - Hazzy - 2010-05-15
One might also notice how every screen with Raikou in it has him in a slightly different stance.
Pokémon Black and White versions - Corn - 2010-05-15
I don't really care about Stealth Rocks, as mono teams usually die to a certain threat besides Stealth Rock anyways. Mono teams are usually rather gimmicky, too.
Of course, RIP Charizard and Articuno and Moltres. They would have been godly Pokemon if it wasn't for Stealth Rock.
Then again, I love Stealth Rock for damaging those damn Zapdos and Gyarados and Salamence.
Pokémon Black and White versions - Bountyan - 2010-05-15
I'm mostly indifferent about Stealth Rock. I just find it useful for easily killing a bunch of Pokemon. It's funny when someone has Yanmega/Charizard/Articuno/Moltres on their team and they take a whopping 50% from Stealth Rock. If you don't want Stealth Rock, you can always Rapid Spin or use a fast Taunt lead anyway.
Imagine if they added an Ice type Stealth Rock next gen, lol.
Pokémon Black and White versions - Will - 2010-05-15
ClawofBeta Wrote:I don't really care about Stealth Rocks, as mono teams usually die to a certain threat besides Stealth Rock anyways. Mono teams are usually rather gimmicky, too.
Of course, RIP Charizard and Articuno and Moltres. They would have been godly Pokemon if it wasn't for Stealth Rock.
Then again, I love Stealth Rock for damaging those damn Zapdos and Gyarados and Salamence.
Er, Molters isn't bad at all, even with rocks.
Great late-game pokemon.
Pokémon Black and White versions - Dyxanije - 2010-05-15
Stealth Rocks have never been a problem for me. I heavily use Taunt and Rapid Spin.
Also, yay Black and White etc.
Pokémon Black and White versions - Yotsuba - 2010-05-15
I personally don't find Steal Rock to be too much of a problem. My teams also have a fast taunting lead, or at least one spinner on them. It was annoying when i first started 4th gen competitive, but it's not really that bad when you get used to it. At first I was thinking "But then it makes it so you have to make room on your team for a Pokemon that can learn Rapid Spin, or you have to have a One taunt lead for your team. It restricts your team more than it should."
I still kinda think that, but I can deal with it. I use Charizard in one of my teams, and he's perfectly fine. By the time he comes out, the rocks are already gone or never even had a chance to be set up.
Hazzy Wrote:[IMGspoiler]http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5506330/images/Pokeman/1273931283430.png[/IMGspoiler]
Lolsprites. Kinda interesting though.
Don't know about the parts being different sprites for better animation, but I guess that's a nice idea. When you think about it, having a good animation for each Pokemon is pretty hard to do. They can't even think of good alternate costumes for each Pokemon, so their idea of a good animation may very well be "I GROW AND GROWL WHILE MOVING MY FINGERS!"
Pokémon Black and White versions - MasPan - 2010-05-15
Dyxanije Wrote:Stealth Rocks have never been a problem for me. I heavily use Taunt and Rapid Spin.
Also, yay Black and White etc.
The issue for me isn't getting rid of them (aside from Rapid Spin not hitting Ghosts) - it's that a single move can automatically do 25% or 50% hp on a fucking switch in, that it can do this damage repeatedly, and that it can actually kill things (as well as Spikes) - if the damage didn't get so fucking crazy, and if it couldn't instagib a pokemon with low HP, I wouldn't mind it.
Pokémon Black and White versions - Corn - 2010-05-15
MasPan Wrote:The issue for me isn't getting rid of them (aside from Rapid Spin not hitting Ghosts) - it's that a single move can automatically do 25% or 50% hp on a fucking switch in, that it can do this damage repeatedly, and that it can actually kill things (as well as Spikes) - if the damage didn't get so fucking crazy, and if it couldn't instagib a pokemon with low HP, I wouldn't mind it.
I'm sure you wouldn't mind when one day you get sweeped by a Salamence.
Pokémon Black and White versions - TøbiasBlack - 2010-05-15
MasPan Wrote:The issue for me isn't getting rid of them (aside from Rapid Spin not hitting Ghosts) - it's that a single move can automatically do 25% or 50% hp on a fucking switch in, that it can do this damage repeatedly, and that it can actually kill things (as well as Spikes) - if the damage didn't get so fucking crazy, and if it couldn't instagib a pokemon with low HP, I wouldn't mind it.
perfectly sound. its great when youre the one giving the rock damage, it sucks when youre the one taking it. but theres always strategies around it, gamefreak likes to troll its customers (awaits epic troll accusation warning), and hey, if it works, right?
who here thinks that pokemon B&W will get a name change in america to not offend ethnic groups? xP
Perhaps pokemon Light and Dark version, with Grey/Shadow being the third installment.