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Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Printable Version

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Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Stereo - 2013-03-25

SaptaZapta Wrote:One thing I did notice when trying to do damage tests on Hero, is that I am having a hard time distinguishing RB (220%) lines from AFA (250%) lines. Could it be that the high non-crit was AFA?

I was mostly relying on the top 3 hits of RB for that reason; the AFA shows up on top of the bottom 1 or 2.
 Spoiler
The 420ks weren't an isolated event anyway, I have another few screenshots of them.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - JoeTang - 2013-03-25

Isn't damage reduced against higher level monsters?

This is how I understand Hero damage to be calculated

(4 * STR + DEX) * M * WATK * (1 + Enrage + Boss + Total Damage) * (Skill) * (Combo + Critical) * (1 + Chance Attack)
Range * (1 + 0.6 + 0 + 0) * (2.20) * (2.0 + [0.35, 0.50]) * (1 + 0)

Going by your screenshots, you appear to
a) have some defense ignore on top of your Combat Mastery, but it isn't 100%
b) have 100% defense ignore but there is reduction occurring from monster level
c) the formula is wrong

With what information I do see, your range is
318813~452742 non-Critical, and 374605~565928 Critical.
With the 35% Defense of Official Knight A, and 50% Defense Ignore from Combat Mastery, this becomes
263021~373512 non-Critical, and 309049~466890 Critical.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Stereo - 2013-03-25

JoeTang Wrote:b) have 100% defense ignore but there is reduction occurring from monster level
c) the formula is wrong

Oh yeah, forgot to mention that... 50% from Combat Mastery, 30% from Leafre Monster Cards, 15% from weapon nebulite, 10% from whichever class link skill (Luminous?) and about 7% from Ambition allegedly = 112%, or 105% even without Ambition. I popped the Nebulite in because Ambition didn't seem to work, and was only taking me to 97% anyway.

Yay for that getting nerfed so I can only cut 75% of pdr in the future. Enough to damage chaos vellum. Seriously though I'm in favour of this particular change, the current additive PDR formula means mob PDR becomes irrelevant.

I can head for Castle Golems, I just preferred a map that Hyper rocks can warp to.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Alkaline - 2013-05-08

How about Paladin's Threaten enhance hyper? Technically it's not a "reinforce" type of hyper, but this makes me wonder if it works like everyone assumed that it would, by simpy adding 20%.
I always fear the game developers did something weird like "20% of 30% = 36%", or even more weird (30% and 20% as separate sources like potentials).

Then again, GMS may, or may not, get multiplicative pdr anyway...

But if we do, AND enhanced Threaten gives 50% pdr... I would think that would be an additional vote for Paladin's being pretty supportive in boss parties. Since 50% from a single source, is pretty significant...

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Takebacker - 2013-05-08

I'm expecting gms unlimited to put a cap on pdr lower than 100%. 90-95% or so maybe.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Clamors - 2013-05-15

So as of right now, Ignore Def is additive in GMS right? There's no reason to go above 100%?

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - ShinkuDragon - 2013-05-15

Clamors Wrote:So as of right now, Ignore Def is additive in GMS right? There's no reason to go above 100%?

yes

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Clamors - 2013-05-15

ShinkuDragon Wrote:yes

I'm actually pretty happy about that change...of all the changes actually...it'll start promoting group bossing runs again instead of people just soloing everything all the time lol.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - ShinkuDragon - 2013-05-15

Clamors Wrote:I'm actually pretty happy about that change...of all the changes actually...it'll start promoting group bossing runs again instead of people just soloing everything all the time lol.

not really, besides pallies i don't think any other class reduces monster PDR (or at least that i can remember) so if anything, people will just bring pally mules.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - valhala556 - 2013-05-15

ShinkuDragon Wrote:not really, besides pallies i don't think any other class reduces monster PDR (or at least that i can remember) so if anything, people will just bring pally mules.

what about mercedes' legendary spear? not sure if it works the same as threaten.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Grey - 2013-05-15

And Demon Slayer's Demon Cry, and Xenon's level 200 (?) Hyper.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - ShinkuDragon - 2013-05-15

valhala556 Wrote:what about mercedes' legendary spear? not sure if it works the same as threaten.

iAmFear Wrote:And Demon Slayer's Demon Cry, and Xenon's level 200 (?) Hyper.

knew my memory was failing me there, not sure about legendary spear, but DS's demon cry is much weaker than threaten iirc (especially if you hyper threaten) and not sure about xenon's 200 hyper, but i think you couldn't spam that? probably wrong.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Grey - 2013-05-15

ShinkuDragon Wrote:knew my memory was failing me there, not sure about legendary spear, but DS's demon cry is much weaker than threaten iirc (especially if you hyper threaten) and not sure about xenon's 200 hyper, but i think you couldn't spam that? probably wrong.

I don't remember so well myself, but I'm pretty sure Cry is weaker, and Meltdown Explosion's debuff is 15 seconds with a 90 second cooldown on the hyper. I don't think the comparative strength really matters, though, unless you had to choose one over the other; I'm pretty sure they all stack.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Clamors - 2013-05-16

ShinkuDragon Wrote:knew my memory was failing me there, not sure about legendary spear, but DS's demon cry is much weaker than threaten iirc (especially if you hyper threaten) and not sure about xenon's 200 hyper, but i think you couldn't spam that? probably wrong.

Legendary Spear for Mercedes reduces def by 20% for 15 seconds in addition to being a high damaging mobbing skill. The skill CD is only 5 seconds so as long as the Merc stays on top of it that's a constant 20% def reduction...not as good as threaten but still effective.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Bomber - 2013-05-16

Threaten gives -50% attack and -50% PDR for 80(?) seconds and -50% accuracy for 8 seconds.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Sorien - 2013-05-20

ShinkuDragon Wrote:not really, besides pallies i don't think any other class reduces monster PDR (or at least that i can remember) so if anything, people will just bring pally mules.

Wild Hunters can reduce a monster's defense by 50% with Blind, but it doesn't work on bosses. It kind of makes the defense reduction useless in most cases, but it is there.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Imitazion - 2013-05-20

how does Asura's (DB hyper) 100% PDR Ignore affect this?
will I ignore all of CPB's 180% PDR?

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Arrol - 2013-05-20

Imitazion Wrote:how does Asura's (DB hyper) 100% PDR Ignore affect this?
will I ignore all of CPB's 180% PDR?

Being that PDR is multiplicative, you should still ignore all his PDR.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - Imitazion - 2013-05-20

Arrol Wrote:Being that PDR is multiplicative, you should still ignore all his PDR.
that is my assumption too, but people ingame claim that it doesn't.

Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills - tecul1 - 2013-05-20

It would make sense though. If you have one source of 100% PDR, you ignore all of a mob's PDR, regardless of PDR mechanics.